coen
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Posts posted by coen
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Glad to see some improvements happening.
Probably noted already:
* when you hit 'edit post' scroll to the edit field instead of staying focused on the post like nothing happened.
* What's the 'display as thumbnail' checkmark doing in the image upload section? If I don't click it I'm not allowed to select the image, so why bother having a checkmark?
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Well, I've finally found some time to work on the drone again... to design the outside of the drone... I guess it's finished, if you guys don't have any remarks that is.
A few suggestions:
'it's way too tight, create some space to fit stuff in!'
'The legs are too small, you'll snap those off!'
'And my first proper investigation: Move the motors higher up, you'll sink!'
Somewhere next week the gnarly job of subdividing it into 3D-printable parts starts. That means choosing printing orientations, bottom planes, hollowing the parts out, creating mounts, etc, etc. Lots of work, but it's great to make some progress again. How's it going with you guys? Any new designs? crashed drones? Working on other stuff?
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After reading through the pulleys thread fully I decided to go for a GT2 pulley/belt system as an upgrade to fix this issue. As that needs new printer parts I firstly reassembled my printer. First results: the clicking sound that had been plagueing it before is gone
. Print quality also is nice, but I am yet to print a full surface to see if the infill issue has been reduced or not (adjusted belt tensions too).The major find however: there is a major offcentre issue visible on the pulley on my y-driving stepper... as well as that on some pulleys the screws push the pulleys offcenter too. So yeah, GT2 upgrade to be ordered this afternoon and until that time: work with what I've got.
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@jonnybischof I got the same and assumed it's part of the forum beta testing that is planned to start today. Are you also part of the beta test group?
Idem here... not part of beta group, so I'm assuming someone ticked a box that is now sending e-mail out to all users who ever liked a post... nice. :(
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Your issue would make total sense if one or more Y axis pulleys aren't centered. Please measure the distance between good or bad areas and see if it's the same as the circumference (from outer surface of the belt's point of view).
The diameter of pulley+belt is 13.7mm, times pi gives 43mm, which is rather perfectly in the range of the spacing issue... I'll inspect the pulleys to see if I can see anything on them from the outside. Do you know if Ultimaker has since upgraded them? I've seen a topic on the forum about custom wellcentered pulleys... I'd rather order those then get a new crooked batch from UM...
here's the custom pulley thread: http://ultimaker.com/en/community/view/4110-top-quality-pulleys-what-do-you-think-is-an-appropriate-price
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A small project that pales in comparison to the great work that was recently posted...
Two gifts for the wedding of a friend of mine. They asked for money for new tableware... but yeah who gives that when you can 3D print. I stole the logo from their invitations, and due to some issues with the 3D printer a lot of putty was involved in achieving the final finish (which still has some 'personality').
You can see the issue thread to see the before putty pictures...
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However this may not be a solution, would it be possible to increase the thickness of the bottom and top layer?
This should be considered as a workaround, not a solution, but I guess the wedding will not wait for your beautifull plate to be ready.
The wedding already took place... I gave the plates with bad infill and asked to get them back after to fix them up properly... so I'm now working with Putty...
Thicker layers don't help, it will just add more layers with holes in them... flow helps a little bit, but then the regions that have proper infill now get 'plowing marks'. These could be sanded down, but yeah :(
As for the rods: I took them to work today and rolled them on a granite block... they're perfectly straight.... that leaves the pulleys or some other issue as the possible cause...
Suggestions welcome!
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mmmm.... it's pretty hard to judge whether the rods are curved or not. I can see a small airgap when I roll em on the table or put the on a ruler... but you would expect this gap to change in size if they are curved and you roll them, but this does not happen, or at least not in a way that I can see it. I don't have a flat table available hear, but I might take them to work to check it out...
what's the best way to test them for curvedness? I can try putting them in a drill and then checking at higher speeds?
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Coen, first of all: beautifull design!
Thanks! But I can't take credit for the logo, I copied it from the invitation :-).
But about the problem:: from the first 1 pictures it is seen that the blue tape is often used, and maybe worn out. The banding is in the same direction as the taperuns. So could you replace the tape (everywhere) and make a first layer to see whether the band still exists?
I actually replaced the tape between printing the square tray and the plate. The plate has a very large flat surface and I was worried about how ugly it would be with all the cracks and holes ;-). So this sadly couldn't be it, as the issue didn't improve between the two prints.
How does the bed look, is it perfectly flat? An easy way to check is to hold a ruler against the surface and hold it up to the light and see if light seeps through.
It is kind of hollow, both in x and y. Only very slightly, if I press down on the ruler it sinks into the tape and the light disappears.
How about the rods of the gantry? Are they all true or do they wobble?
Yesterday I tried printing a full size flat object but without filament to check this out. By eye I can't make out any wobble during the printing on the gantry axes. I'll take it apart tonight though to see how they hold up when I roll em on a flat table.
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Sorry for the long radio-silence... parts are in!
However, I've also landed a new job and girlfriend... so designing and building the multicopter has been moved to the evening hours/weekends :(. It'll probably be somewhere in August that I make some progress. How are you guys doing? Flying?
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After many (3) years of semi-reliable service my Ultimaker Original has now developed a problem (or it has become more apparent) that I can't seem to fix. I was printing a wedding gift for friends of mine: a plate with their initials. In this large flat object a regular banding became apparent: good infill, bad infill, good infill, bad infill, roughly in y-direction. This effect shows from the bottom layer, to the top, and also through the whole prints.
Pictures tell a thousands words, so without further ado, here's a complete novel (apologies for the coordinate direction not being the same in all pictures, but be assured: the pattern is in y-direction):
On the small one the problem wasn't that apparent on the top, but I still need to fix it with Putty.
However, on the big plate it is really bad:
notice also the loose support material: it would be a really good idea for Ultimaker to make round corners instead of the perpendicular ones: perpendicular motions put a peeling force on the deposited filament.
I can go through the motions and put a whole load of info about cura settings here, but as it has happened now in two big prints I'm pretty convinced it's a hardware issue related to the driving system in x/y. Maybe banana rods lifting the printhead at a regular interval, or perhaps a speeding issue due to offcentered pulleys...
The extruder train seems unlikely as you would then expect the effect to be regular in extruded length, not in y-coordinate. Issues with the bed would show more heavily in the bottom layers, and disappear at the top layers, which is not the case.
My current approach would be to take the machine apart, inspect all parts, replace where necessary and then put it back together again. Any idea of what to check before I start doing that?
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My UMO+ also does tack tack on both axes. But I think my rods are bananas... :(
Same problem on this Ultimaker original. Every since the beginning (sep 2012). The guys at Protospace didn't know what to make of it, they replaced the bearings, but that didn't change the sound. I'm at the point of taking it apart completely as I am having some other issues too... I'm suspecting banana rods too.
However, with regard to the clicking sounds: I've always suspected them to be caused by the wooden parts moving ever so slightly within the lasercut slots: the frame is constructed in a way that it enhances sound (acoustic guitar anyone? ;-)), so that might have to do with it?
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Now that you are talking about this telemetry and other things about the taranis, ill have to also investigate this radio some more. I have two of the turnigy 9x radios, one that is running on the turnigy 2.4ghz v2 radios, and the other on a dragonlink. The dragon link system is hacked into my phantom v2+ system. <- different thread for that one.
Well, in the end I did go for the Turnigy 9XR Pro as well... the Taranis only comes via HK global warehouse currently, which demands a huge payment in shipping (€50,-!), with the added risk of 20% customs surcharge and €14,- administration cost... with all that calculated in it actually becomes a lot more expensive than the Pro with FrSky D8-IIR telemetry set.
For pricing reasons I also ordered some parts from RCTimer... which actually only asks for $2,- shipping... very strange... well, we'll see, it will probably take a lot longer too.
As for the size of the wiring that i used is as follows. The battery terminals are on the XT90 connectors with 14AWG wire, that should be sufficient for 32 Amps. That is the same size wiring that is used on my packs. Use this table for reference HERE
For my speed controller wire size i'm using 20awg for power and 22 awg for motor wires coupled with 2mm bullets. For my 250 setup this is perfect, use that link that i posted to figure out what you need. Bare in mind that you dont want to over kill too much as it will add weight!
You're actually referring to the exact same table I was using. However, you chose the Chassis rating instead of the power transmission that I was looking at. When you compare those ratings to the ratings you see mentioned on fora then people use them at much higher amps.
Could you explain the choices you made? The XT90 connector is suited for much higher amps (90A continuous) than the 30A you mention. The AWG14 is actually what I'll be using for the ESC-Motor part of my setup (30A esc, 22A max motor draw), with 3,5mm bullets. What draw do you have on your motors/escs? For my battery I go with AWG10 and the XT90 connector as well, so quite a lot heavier than yours (I'm expecting around 80A max).
@gr5 Could you elaborate on your wire sizes and connectors a bit perhaps? Now you only mention that people think they look heavy, without giving other people (me
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This is also the first time i am using the PDB with regulators. [...] I'll let you know if i have any issues.
I'm still rocking the turnigy 9x, and the 9xr pro is the 2nd iteration of that PLUS HK sells the correct lipo for it as well. That is a decent radio to start with and will have most if not all the features you may need, if not, its also hackable/flashable.
For the TX or RX, get one that has a good balance of quality and price that you can afford, Also check out how much the receivers are as a single unit, to evaluate the cost to have multiple models. Remember that for this small scale, long range and more powerful radios might cause interference to other components. 250 quads don't really have much room to space components out. 2.4ghz for control and 5.8ghz for video will be sufficient for close fpv flying.
Good to hear from you again MrWong, and nice pictures! Where's the inflight vid? ;-)
Thanks for the advice... it looks like I won't be able to order all parts from one HK warehouse anyway, so I'll probably get a Taranis or 9XR... the nice thing of the Taranis is that I"ll have built-in telemetry immediately... will investigate a little further, but good to hear that you're happy with 9XR. People on fora were saying that the Taranis gives a lot more bang for a little more buck compared to 9XR. Did you consider Taranis at all?
As I'm moving towards finalizing the orders I'm getting close to the smaller bits and bytes: wiring and connectors. Could you comment on what you are using?
I'm looking at approximately 22A max current draw from the motors. So I'm thinking I should be fine using EC3 (3,5mm bullet) connectors for the part from ESC to motor, using AWG14(?) wiring?. The average draw should be much smaller than 22A.
For the wiring to the battery it should be much heavier: even AWG6, using XT90 connectors... is this too heavy? What guidelines do you use? If I look at the official AWG tables it results in wiring that to my inexperienced mind looks very heavy!
What do your wiring/connector schematics look like?
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@coen - don't assume you have to get everything at HK. Their prices are amazing until you go to the shipping page where if you are ordering from a HK in a different country the shipping can add 50% to the price! When you include shipping, other sellers are often cheaper than HK.
I've selected everything at EU warehouse, so this should be OK right? Do you know of better suppliers in Holland? I'll do a separate scan of price when all the components are clear, but I'd prefer to get everything in one place in one go...
Did you check that the ublox is compatible with your flight controller?
Did a quick google and found some people using it, but I'll have to investigate in more detail to also order the correct cables and connectors.
You don't need a power controller board but your flight controller needs 5V so I ended up buying a little module that solders into the power line and in addition to creating the 5V it also supplies my APM with current draw information which isn't critical but nice.
Check out this mini 36x36 PDB with 12v and 5v step downs.
Careful when looking at PDB's with step downs, the adjustable ones are not that good of quality from what i have been reading and are not the correct size for mini quads....
My ESC's have a switched BEC on them... so no special 5V connection necessary (instead I'll have to remove 3 from the signal cables). However, looking at the PDB MrWong has posted this might be a more interesting option: go for non-BEC ESC's and use this PDB, also making it more future proof with 12V for FPV. The only worry would be the cooling, as this board would be place centrally in the housing, instead of the BEC's on the ESCS which are on the arms and closer to airflow. What's your experience with this MrWong?
Further updates:
I received my toy drone today and had a first fling of indoor flying with it... I can totally understand getting disoriented. There's also very little maneuvring space indoor, however, once trimmed correctly the thing is surprisingly stable! Outdoor practicing time when the bloody rain stops :-S.
TX/RX wise I was leaning towards a Turnigy 9XRPro with a FrSky DF tx/rx combo pack. However, after reading the reviews I think it might be better to immediately go for the Taranis. Any advice?
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I was gonna stay clear of this topic, but as I tried posting a large post this evening in one of the other topics I figured it'd be good to drop all the issues associated with that in one post as to give a complete 'user story'. Some bugs/features are probably already noted, and as Sander is enjoying MakerFaire, I'm also not expecting instant responses.
First off an issue that I've been having for a couple of days already in firefox 37.02: the tabs containing the forum continue in a 'loading' state, aggregated screenshot below:
. Due to this I can't post anything, I first have to 'stop' the page from loading. Cool to see image uploading working a lot smoother btw!Other issues:
- Great to see a working chat, now a smooth way to point noobs there
- My post was eaten by the forum, I don't know how or why. I previewed it a number of times and it came out the right way, but when finally pressing 'post commment' I ended up on the thread, but not with my post showing (and an empty reply box below). Preventively copy&pasting allowed me to repost it,after which it did turn up, on a new page of the thread, so that might have to do with it.
- there's no auto-url conversion, so in a long post it becomes really tedious having to scroll back up to get to the formatting buttons... all the while the stupid top tab does come dropping down... how about moving the formatting buttons there, so that at least something useful drops down when scrolling?
- There's no way to make a table... nor is whitespace conserved. So I ended up making a 'code' field, having to remove a lot of columns of information.
- How to include urls in code or tables?
- When editing a post with code tags, the whitespace inside of it is lost and you basically lose your formatting
- when you hit edit post there is no visual feedback that you need to scroll down to the end of the page where your actual post is located...
- gameification... :(even GoT (tweakers.net) has joined the hipster movement it seems...
- more/better smileys please... crying and banging head against the wall would be nice
Anyway, Sander: thanks for taking all the flak. It must've been really bad on you the last few weeks. I hope you are having fun at MakerFaire, it's filled with interesting people and projects.
I appreciate the effort that is going into making the forum workeable, but I truely have my doubts about the path if reinventing the wheel is the right path. Especially after having seen the lack of professionalism of the party responsible for the development and management of the process.
For the rest I'll go with some sage advice:
I'm putting myself in "if you don't have anything nice to say"-mode, because if I let loose... yeah...
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- Great to see a working chat, now a smooth way to point noobs there
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wtf... post was eaten by the forum... luckily I copied & saved.
When you get your toy, after you feel really good at it, try having it pointing towards you until you can (without thinking) always move away from obstructions in a panic instead of towards them, lol. Also practice sideways where it is facing 90 degrees to the direction you are facing. In fact you should probably do that first from my experience. Get really good at "sideways" orientation (landing taking off, repeatedly, on small targets, thnigs like that).
Haha, those are exactly the kind of things I'm worried about. I've also 'downloaded' an RC flight simulator that should be able to work with a transmitter... haven't tried that out yet though. First part selection and ordering...
So I've spent a day diving into the core components and have come up with the following (sheet also updated). Please comment and question me on them! Also, I'll add the list of components-to-do, so let me know if I miss anything on there.
First off the system purpose:
- large starter quad, but with the possibility to quickly grow to autonomous/camera use: so large payload, full autopilot, long flight duration. For now I've left out camera gimbals and fpv options, but these will probably be ordered in the future.
- Initial guess: preferrably 15-30min flight time, +/- 2kg take-off weight including future payloads.
So translating that into the start components: motor/prop combo:
- You want your quad to be able to lift about double the proposed system weight for comfortable handling, and with a 20% margin due to my guesswork you get approximately 1200gr of thrust per motor/prop combo. That's quite a lot, so we should be looking at large diameter props and low KV motors.
- Iterating between xcoptercalc, HobbyKing's available parts, youtube videos, drone sites, etc. I came up with an 11" diameter 4,7" pitch propellor and a NTM 2830 800KV motor, operating on a 4S voltage.
- This draws a max of 15A according to xcoptercalc, but based on future growth I went for a 30A ESC. Also for long flight duration I chose two 5000 mAh Lipoly packs, the most light weight ones for a reasonable price I could find on HK.
- Flight controller wise I'm still doubting my choice. I really like the APM FC as I've been following their development for the last 6years. However, they're switching over to PixHawk, which is really way above my budget, especially as I expect to crash my first quad... there's some clones available, but no suitable option in the HK EU store. In there is a MultiWii board suitable for the MegaPirate firmware, so I opted for that one in combination with a Neo-6 GPS unit. Other options (on HK) are either way above budget or don't include possibilities for GPS and full auto (waypoint navigation).
All in all this gives the following component list... grrr no way to do tables on this forum... and either fixed spacing or urls :(
Manufacturer Model Version WeightTurnigy NTM 2830 800KV 260HobbyKing NTM accessories 28 series 55,2Hobbyking Slow Fly Electric 1147 SF CCW 20 HobbyKing Slow Fly Electric 1147 SF CW 20Rotorstar 30A 104MultiWii Aio FC v2 Megapirate 14Ublox Neo-6 GPS 10Zippy Compact 5000mAh 4s 1p 25C 976
Links separately then (having to scroll up and down to insert the tags :(, with the stupid top bar interfering...):
HK Slow Fly Electric 1147 prop
Zippy Compact 5000mAh 4s 1p 25C
What's still to do:
- Transmitter and receiver combo. Probably with telemetry included, so also a telemetry tx.
- I'm not really sure I need a power distribution board?
- Check for cables/connectors/adapters etc.
- Design and 3D print a frame
- Future: investigate GoPro gimbals
- Future: investigate FPV components
- Transmitter and receiver combo. Probably with telemetry included, so also a telemetry tx.
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Lets start with some of the frame revisions and changes i have made to my frame. Bare in mind this first frame that i wanted, i did not want any FPV equipment on board. I wanted a super fast light weight flyer, but fpv can and will be added later once i get the frame sorted out.
Here is the parts list for the build
4 x Multistart Elite 2300kv CW and CCW motors
4 x 12A blue ice simonK flash ESC's
1 x 36 x 36 mini PDB, next version will have integrated 5v and 12v step downs
1 x mini KK 2.1.5 board with case flashed with Stevis
4 x 5045 props CW and CCW
1 x turnigy 9x receiver
Batteries - 3s 1500mah 35-70c or 3s 1300mah 45-90c
misc hardware, some M3 bolts, nylon nuts and standoffs, stainless lock nuts
Here are some photos that i had taken during the process.
Nice build MrWong! I'm wondering: why did you make a frame out of flat parts instead of using the 3D printers capabilities to produce something fluent and/or integrate spacers and such?
I'm also curious how you selected the parts for the drone: what's your process? What weight is the flyer and what kind of flight time do you reach?
I'm currently trying to find components based on my initial guess flight time of +/- 30min and a 1kg payload... from first exploration these seem quite exotic requirements, only possible in hexa's or octo's? To practice flying I did order a toy drone, so I won't crash the result of all my hard work the 1st time :-S.
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I know, right? Kind of vague. WellvTX: Immersion RC FPV gear
means video transmitter is made by Immersion - they have 3 different transmitters here:
http://www.immersionrc.com/fpv-products/
The frsky d4rii is both a receiver which sits on the quad and sends at least 4 signals to your controlling computer for the 4 control sticks on the transmitter (the controlling computer helps you keep the quad stable and typically has gyros built in as a minimum). The d4r-ii also can *transmit* telemetry (like say gps settings if you have a gps on your quad) but it sounds like that feature is not used. It's a very tiny light weight radio receiver though and is compatible with many different hand held transmitters (the thing with the joysticks).
Normally you would get your transmitter/receiver combination for manual operation right... so does this link come as an extra with the transmitter on the drone and the receiver in your video device near the pilot? And what exactly do you need then? There's no display included is there? Or do you get a special transmitter with a display to which you then hook up these components? Anyway, my main conclusion was that if you just buy these two things you don't have a complete fpv set-up yet... so that's what I'm looking for: what other components would you need then?
As for the sheet:
I've updated the few components mentioned in makezine.. they're quite general, with a link to instructional video's and various options for components. I'll explore these and than order parts :-D.
Here's the link to the sheets:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1LF8jzXoFDleyP3YF3eb1JEQPQ8eOfPjmKctFca1AVGg/edit?usp=sharing
And to the makezine hangar:
http://makezine.com/makerhangar/
[update] still no automagic link conversion on this new forum... :( UM makes me sad lately
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Google sheet updated with all the latest components posted by people. Make magazine drones remain to be done.
I just found out about this thread, its not that pretty looking but its very small and flies great.vTX: Immersion RC FPV gear
RX: frsky d4rii
Hi Tottenham, you seem to be one of the few FPV flyers in here... could you comment on the vTX and RX modules? I'm a complete noob in this regard, so I have no idea what these components do or if what you have listed is a complete system or not?
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Grrrr lost my reply due to pressing wrong button... here goes again...
Great to see you still contributing MrWong! As I find myself without a job again, living in a rural area and great weather this project has made it to the top of my list again. What I'll do is update the google sheet with all components listed here after the last update I did, as well as with those picked in Make Magazine's latest drones (http://makezine.com/projects/hovership-3d-printed-racing-drone/).
After that I think I'll take Woofy's approach and just order a bunch of parts and start printing and flying... he seems to have made great progress by just diving in. By the way who else is in the Netherlands... I thought you were MrWong? And Titus too right (if he's still around with the new forum :().
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I haven't seen Invesalius mentioned here yet... (ok, I'm blind, Handyman posted about it). it's what the guy working on 3D printing medical imagery at our local hospital uses...
http://svn.softwarepublico.gov.br/trac/invesalius
I'm not sure it can handle your data formats though... DICOM seems to be the medical standard format.
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1) Set the "Printer interface" to "Pronterface UI" in the perferences.6) During printing, adjust the temperature with the up/down controls, or by entering a temperature.
7) Speed controls are absent. But, if you really must. M220 Sxxx to control the speed. (Or optionally, get the more advanced printer interface plugin, which is somewhere on the forums and has buttons for this)
But, in the end. If you are printing with USB, you're putting yourself at risk of unfinished prints.
Thanks! I didn't know about the M220 command, so with finally having a day off I went ahead and implemented almost all the old functionality (sorry for the crosspost):
http://umforum.ultimaker.com/index.php?/topic/4618-new-cura-printer-interface/?p=85763
This was quite a bit of work for me, being such a noob, but a good start of the year non the less :-).
By the way with regard to USB printing: back when I got my printer I compiled the firmware to work at 115200 baudrate, which fixes any issues regarding USB (I've never had a print fail since). PS: all ultimaker original owners without Ulticontrollers are in the 'USB printing' category... well, for me at least for a few weeks as I finally got a raspberry pi.
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Here is my attempt at a new printer interface. I just took the code from EvilGrass's version and gave it more room and added a few buttons that I find useful.
I also added heatbed control to Wayne's module and noticed in the Cura 14.05-RC4 there was a different extruder control image so added it also.
Thanks Dave!
After some discussion with Daid about why he 'stole' the controls that I needed with my Ultimaker Original via USB, he talked about this plugin. Since Flow and Speed were still missing I've updated it, also moving the 'fan control' to the button layout as I felt it's original implementation was kinda awkward in it's style.
Screenshots:
As for Dave's comment: I've also not got a dual extrusion machine, so the code for dual extrusion is untested. I feel that especially the extruder button is probably not functional. Feel free to test and update, please let us know here once you do.
I've tested the single extrusion plugin and it seems to be fully functional.
Download links:
Single: https://www.dropbox.com/s/puwdzd6nyhhbw9t/FullUI_single.7z?dl=0
Double: https://www.dropbox.com/s/d9jdc9vy526auje/FullUI_double.7z?dl=0
Wishlist for Daid:
A way to obtain info about the print via cura:
- print temperature
- print speed
- print time and estimated time remaining
- current layer/height
Happy printing!
. Print quality also is nice, but I am yet to print a full surface to see if the infill issue has been reduced or not (adjusted belt tensions too).
) the chance to prevent doing the same.
Clicking on Ultimater 2 Extende while print head is moving along Y-Axis
in UltiMaker 3D printers
Posted
To check how off-center my pulleys were I took the complete x-y gantry apart and after measuring the puleys put it back together again (as I was waiting for a GT2 pulley/belt order from China to be shipped). This strangely also solved my clicking problem...
Not an outcome you would want as I still can't pinpoint the exacty cause... but rebuilding the gantry and maybe swapping around some pulleys can certainly fix the problem.