Does anyone already have installed the Bondtech Extruder/Feeder?

[ataraxis 51]

Hi everyone!

I still have some problems with grinding/slipping filaments sometimes (especially if the infill speed differs too much from the wall speed), therefore I searched the internet for an alternative and found the BondTech Extruder/Feeder.

It's relatively expensive (aprox. 180€) - therefore I am looking for someone who already tried it at an Ultimaker.

Cheers!

Edited February 20, 2016 by Guest

[neotko 1,417]

It's on the price range of other planetary geared nema 17. I suppose it indeed has bigger torque. The 'no grinding' effect sounds great over the paper.

[ataraxis 51]

you are right but it's expensive compared to other "selfmade"-solutions and anyhow: it is a lot of money for something that - maybe - doen't work as good as expected.

[neotko 1,417]

I suppose that the error the make not doing open source. It blocks the experts (not me) to check and comment the stuff.

Edit:

I was clearly totally wrong! All info it's at https://www.youmagine.com/designs/bondtech-extruder--2

Edited August 9, 2015 by Guest

[Labern 774]

you can buy the kit and print the housing. they also have stl's for UM2

its a lot cheaper that way

[ataraxis 51]

unfortunately the kit's do no include the stepper motor if I am right?!

[neotko 1,417]

Seems so. But also seems (not sure if I got it right) that they do 5.1:1 gear with that two brown color pieces. They must interlock with some kind of bearing... I need to see the stls first

[ataraxis 51]

btw: why do they use a gearbox at the stepper?

[neotko 1,417]

To increase the torque, like the big geared extruder of ultimaker original. I suppose.

[Labern 774]

If it's only to increase torque couldn't you just use it on the standard UM2 steeper? If you problem is slipping and not lack of power then it would still be an improvement.

[Labern 774]

It states the correct size shaft required so you would need to check that it would fit.

I'm also interested in those geared drive wheels.

[neotko 1,417]

After checking the videos and all. The system it's a double grip without tensioners a mirror gear with bearing and all connected to a planetary geared nema 17. With a dia 8 shaft.

For the price the solution seems nice. I would love to see a dia 5 solution so there's no need to use the planetary geared motor.

Also @bondtech user seems like opened an account so he might answer better.

Many details are at youmagine and the gear designs.

https://www.youmagine.com/designs/bondtech-extruder--2

[dmolina 3]

There is this design I'm using that has the same principle, that is, the double geared coordinated system, and it doesn't use planetary geared motor.

I made a reduced version that doesn't use the belts, and instead uses 2 rubber wheels printed in ninjaflex filament. It's working pretty great.

I haven't uploaded my mods anywhere yet, but will do in a couple of days... Tell me if it interests you.

[dmolina 3]

Ow, the same designer also made a 4:1 printable gearbox, if that interests you.

[Labern 774]

There is this design I'm using that has the same principle, that is, the double geared coordinated system, and it doesn't use planetary geared motor.

I made a reduced version that doesn't use the belts, and instead uses 2 rubber wheels printed in ninjaflex filament. It's working pretty great.

I haven't uploaded my mods anywhere yet, but will do in a couple of days... Tell me if it interests you.

 

Are the geared drive wheels driven of the extruder motor?

[dmolina 3]

Yes, as you can see on the stepper in the following image:

The feeder grip shaft wheel goes above it...

[neotko 1,417]

I still think that a feeder with dual metal grip could make a cleaner feed, grinding it less. The problem I see with the bondtech it's that there's no quick release. But if the inner design it's really good it might be perfect for flexible filaments. So far the feeder I want to try first it the one @meduza it's working on that has a 1.8:1 gear with gt2 pulleys.

[neotko 1,417]

Just a quick draw without the proper tools of an idea for a cheaper Bond-tech solution. Also it solves one problem I think bond tech imo since it needs exact pressure for the feeder (so perfect filament) and to remove the filament you need to use the motor (no quick pull out there).

Ofc the gear it's just a fast draw, it might be better to make one more solid with more teeth, or use a metal one like the reprap feeders (Been trying to find the size or specs without luck but most of them are 10.7-11mm so it might work with that).

Mk7 leaves a minimum air of 2.75mm, so with the maximum pressure it won't crash it less than that.

Just dropping ideas.

Edited August 19, 2015 by Guest

[ataraxis 51]

the downsides of the bondtech are in my eyes:

 

• variable axis distance (WTF?!)
  
• no quick-release
  
• high price
  

 

the following is my first approach of a low-cost solution and uses only available parts, in theory it should be easy to release the filament too:

you can easily change the distance between the two driving gears because of the little tensioner gear.

please feel free to criticize!!!

Edited August 21, 2015 by Guest

[Labern 774]

is your picture showing a spring loaded belt tensioner. if so on retractions this will move just as much as play in gears. if you have the right gear profile the play can be very small.

[ataraxis 51]

yes you are right, i didn't thought about that - i will remove the spring (it's just a first approach) - thank you!. but I still don't like the idea of a variable distance between the axes of two gears... that's just not as it should be, right?

Edited August 21, 2015 by Guest

[Labern 774]

Just a quick draw without the proper tools of an idea for a cheaper Bond-tech solution. Also it solves one problem I think bond tech imo since it needs exact pressure for the feeder (so perfect filament) and to remove the filament you need to use the motor (no quick pull out there).

Ofc the gear it's just a fast draw, it might be better to make one more solid with more teeth, or use a metal one like the reprap feeders (Been trying to find the size or specs without luck but most of them are 10.7-11mm so it might work with that).

Mk7 leaves a minimum air of 2.75mm, so with the maximum pressure it won't crash it less than that.

Just dropping ideas.

 

You could have the non driven side swing out like roberts feeder. you would just need to make sure the gears mesh properly. the swing out section would be quite large but you could get it to work.

[Labern 774]

yes you are right, i didn't thought about that - i will remove the spring. but i still don't like the idea of a variable distance between the axes of two gears... that's just no as it should be.

 

That's true, I have seen one that use a worm gear so it didn't matter if the distance changed. I may have to find the picture.

[Labern 774]

So you can buy the Bontech mechanical kit for $84.90 or get the Printrbot gear head extruder for $20, and you pretty much get the same thing. Hmmm mes thinks i would go with the Printrbot one.

[neotko 1,417]

True I googled t and there are quite abbit of post about the gears loosing their grip quite fast.