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Nicolinux

Printing with colorFabb XT-CF20 - UM2

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Hi,

I am trying to print with XT-CF20 but I can't make it stick to the bed. For the nozzle I tried temp. ranges from 250° to 260°. For the heated bed 70° to 75°. I have (over)used the glue stick to no avail.

One thing I learned - the bed leveling is key. So I leveled the bed/nozzle to be really really close to each other but still no luck. Also tried tampering with the leveling mid-print. There is a sweet spot somewhere but if I get it to stick at one far end, the filament deataches itself at the front (or somewhere else).

I am using the Olsson Block with an stainless nozzle (0.4mm).

I have uploaded a video:

 

Do you have any ideas?

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Hi Nico, you've made a lot of progress on your machines since we both started out about the same time!

I read the Tips and Tricks on ColorFabb, it looks like you are doing everything they suggest

Adviced 3d printing temperature:

240-260C (colorFabb_XT filament produced before 7th februari can be printed at 220 - 240C)

 

Adviced 3d print speed:

40 - 70 mm/s

 

Advised Heated bed

60-70C (colorFabb_XT filament produced before 7th februari 2014 can be printed on a cold bed)

 

Build platform

For our latest release of colorFabb_XT (production date Februari 2014) we advice to print on a heated bed. If you’re using aluminum of glass as the build plate we advice using glue stick to make sure the first layer sticks well and keeps the part from warping. After printing, the build plate needs to cool down to about 20-30 C at which point you can remove the printed part.

Edited by Guest
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For me it looks as if it comes out too cold. Be aware that the stainless steel nozzle might not have reached its full temperature when the Pt100 in the heater block says so.

You might try preheating the nozzle and the bed and wait for a minute before you start the print.

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Just wait for the new nozzle @anders-olsson it's making. With that the pain of stainless steel (for me at least) just went away.

Also it prints just fantastic in pla, heats like brass and deals with carbon filament (or abrasive ones) like if they where just normal filaments. It's worth the wait.

Edited by Guest
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I had a hard time getting XT-CF20 to stick to the bed. Try slowing your Bottom layer speed down (10-20mm/s) and changing the "Initial layer line width" to something like 120%. The XT filament is "sticky" and tends to want to stick to the nozzle itself so make sure its clean before you print.

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Thanks guys,

I now have some success. I switched to a brass nozzle (even if it will break after a while). I have also increased the first layer height. It sticks better now, although at some points it just won't. I suspect that my heated bed is not entierly flat. Slowing the first layer is a good idea too. Gijs from colorFabb also suggested to increase flow to too. I'll try both and report back.

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Here's a little update.

Increasing the flow did not have a big impact, but increasing the "Initial layer line width" helped because the extruded strands of filament are much wider thus allowing for more surface to stick to the bed. XT-CF20 still barely sticks, but at least I've got some successful prints at last. I have also ordered 3DLac and will try that too.

I have tried different nozzles (the 0.8mm one is fun to watch... looks like toothpaste smeared on the heated bed :) ) but I will stick to the stainless steel one for now because I have a huge project to print in XT-CF20. I could use brass nozzles until they degrade but then I'd have bad prints if the nozzle decides to fail mid-print.

But now something else came up. No matter what nozzle I use (steel or brass), I can't print with fans on because the heater can't catch up quickly enough with the difference in temperature and the temp error kicks in. I guess the heater is not strong enough to keep the temperature at 260° no matter what. I tried different "Fan full on at height" settings, but without success so far.

Anybody else had this problem?

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Yes I was about to order the 35W heater. But I didn't think about the firmware... What do I need to do? Somehow I managed all these years to not have to build my own UM2 firmware :)

 

Very good question. I actually thought of this line . But it seems the feature is disabled. @daid: Shouldn't that and the next line be enabled?

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I used esun cleaning filament because I was going to change from carbonfil to cf20. And the cleaning filament fused to the carbon just like if it was cement. To clear the heat barrel I had to drill after trying boiling it. And the nozzle had some some too but I didn't wanted to drill that because it's a test nozzle so I sent it back to anders so they could reuse some 'main parts'. That nozzle it's amazing a shame esun cleaning filament fuses with carbon so badly.

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You shouldn't need to print it at 260º, I had success printing at 245º. Also try using a white PVA (Elmer's) glue/water solution instead of the glue stick. Use something like 3:1 water to glue ratio in a bottle. I usually heat the bed to 70º, put some of the glue/water solution on a paper towel and spread it over the bed. It creates a thinner, more even coating than the glue sticks.

Be warned the brass nozzle will degrade significantly over even a half a roll. You will likely need to re-level the bed before every print.

https://ultimaker.com/en/community/view/11141-nickel-plating-nozzles-for-carbon-filled-filaments-updated?page=1&sort=

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The bed adherence problem is no more! This 3DLac stuff is awesome. I'll try your solution when I run out of it.

http://www.ebay.de/itm/3DLac-Spruhkleber-Haftspray-Einfuhrungsangebot-/321841529662

I tried printing at lower temperatures (with a brass nozzle and steel) but there was under extrusion. Even at 260° (with the steel nozzle) I've had a ruined print because of it. I'll post some pics soon.

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Getting close, but not there yet. As I've said, thanks to 3DLac the prints now stick to the bed.

But they are not sturdy and break easily along the x/y plane (layer). Seems like the inter-layer adhesion is off.

I have two huge rolls of XT-CF20 here and when I started experimenting with it, I wanted to print this spool holder:

http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:767737

The sturdiest print I've got so far was with a 0.8mm nozzle and the following settings:

 

  • layer height: 0.4
  • shell thickness: 1.6
  • bottom/top: 1.2
  • infill: 30
  • speed: 30
  • initial layer thickness: 1.6

 

08_1.thumb.jpg.59ad72cede2421523fb9a912c9ecb444.jpg

08_2.thumb.jpg.5b71d3ee37e52a6e56614ec4f0a7e921.jpg

This print is ugly, but very sturdy. There were lots of filament strands that I needed to trim off (retraction is an issue - too much and you get under extrusion, too little and it looks like it needs a shave).

But since I can't keep using brass nozzles because I don't want to loose longer prints due to nozzle failure, I started tinkering with the 0.4mm steel nozzle again. Always printing at 260° and without fans or else the temp error kicks in because the heater can't keep up.

Print settings:

 

  • layer height: 0.3
  • shell thickness: 1.6
  • bottom/top: 1.2
  • infill: 100
  • speed: 25
  • initial layer thickness: 0.3
  • initial layer line width: 120(%)

 

04_1.thumb.jpg.de33262293cbad984890384213c101b3.jpg

Looks better and there is barely a need to trim stuff off. But, there is always a but...

04_2.thumb.jpg.27603f225cfddfde429e96081aa421b9.jpg

04_3.thumb.jpg.1f75110ff3dc0665414623e846d1f52f.jpg

04_4.thumb.jpg.8e15daa58814b4caa3543469283976c3.jpg

It breaks easily along the x/y axis. Keep in mind that it was printed at 100% infill. No way that would have happened with PLA. Even if those "ears" are the predetermined breaking points, I'd expect XT-CF20 to at least perform like PLA (if not better) in this regard.

That's why I think there is still something fishy.

08_1.thumb.jpg.59ad72cede2421523fb9a912c9ecb444.jpg

08_2.thumb.jpg.5b71d3ee37e52a6e56614ec4f0a7e921.jpg

04_1.thumb.jpg.de33262293cbad984890384213c101b3.jpg

04_2.thumb.jpg.27603f225cfddfde429e96081aa421b9.jpg

04_3.thumb.jpg.1f75110ff3dc0665414623e846d1f52f.jpg

04_4.thumb.jpg.8e15daa58814b4caa3543469283976c3.jpg

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Have you tried to disable combing. On S3D if I activate the option that does something like combing I got something like that because the filament it's flowing out so easy that with the combing move the filament actually keep flowing (sticking to the nozzle and making a bad start on infills/outlines). Try disable it. On s3d you can just click a button to always retract when moving. I suppose on cura you can just use the retract-while-combing pluging?

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