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Ultimaker vs Older Makerbox Dual question

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So I'm thinking about buying a new printer. My first was an original Makerbox Cupcake and it wasn't very useful. My second was a chinese Makerbot dual extruder clone and it's been pretty good. I've designed and printed a few useful parts using Sketchup plus the software that came with the printer. I know I can probably upgrade some things on the software side and do better, but the printer probably is what it is in terms of resolution and such unless I really want to start hacking, which I don't.

I want to buy something that works well.

So what's my question? The one problem outside of just general resolution issues and such with my current printer is when I need to print something more than a couple square inches on the build platform. The only way I've found to keep the print from "rolling up" some at the edges is to make a slurry of ABS using acetone. I spread the slurry on the heated platform (which also has kapton tape on it) and that helps...up to a point. If I get above six square inches or so, even that doesn't work sometimes. I've played with different temperatures on the platform, but never found something that works repeatably.

One of the reasons I'd want a new printer is for the even bigger build envelope. But that's of little use if I still have trouble with the edges of larger items rolling up. Is that solved these days? And if so, how?

Thanks for any pointers on this. The Ultimaker 2+ looks great in so many ways, but this one annoying problem with my current printer is what scares me some.

--Donnie

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As you are talking about ABS-acetone slurry, I assume you print foremost ABS.

Closing the walls is a must for ABS, otherwise warping will kill almost any print. Also copolyester - an alternative to ABS you should really consider due to being less hazardous - will profit from a closed chamber. It's up to you to close the top of a printer.

All this can and has been done with an Ultimaker 2+. You may find quite some examples here on this forum.

Usually people overestimate the amount of prints larger than the UM2+ build volume. You may check how many of the prints you made within a year or so were actually outside this volume.

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I do print primarily in ABS.

As for the closed chamber, I did upgraded my Makerbot-clone to a closed chamber and that didn't seem to help much.

As for build volume, I wasn't talking about needing more than the UM2+, I just meant the UM2+ was a candidate because it's bigger than my current printer.

--Donnie

 

all most all beds lose heat at the edges. that will cause prints to curl .

Ed

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They don't curl due to cooler temps, they curl there because that is where the forces are strongest. The upper layers are pulling horizontally inward - the longer the distance the stronger the force. Particularly read #6 below. With blue tape instead of glass you also have to clean the blue tape with alcohol to remove waxy surface. The problem you talk about still happens to people who don't know about the tricks below.

===

lifting corners, curling corners, part sticking to glass

1) Make sure the glass is clean if you haven't cleaned it for a few weeks. You want a very thin coat of PVA glue which is found in hairspray, glue stick, wood glue. If you use glue stick or wood glue you need to dilute it with water - about 5 to 10 parts water to 1 part glue. So for example if you use glue stick, apply only to the outer edge of your model outline then add a tablespoon of water and spread with a tissue such that you thin it so much you can't see it anymore. wood glue is better. hairspray doesn't need to be diluted. When it dries it should be invisible. This glue works well for most plastics.

2) Heat the bed. This helps the plastic fill in completely (no air pockets) so you have better contact with the glass. For PLA any temp above 40C is safe. I often print at 60C bed.

3) heat the bed (didn't I already say that?). Keeping the bottom layers above the glass temp of the material makes it so the bottom layers can flex a bit (very very tiny amount) and relieve the tension/stress. For PLA 60C is better than 50C. 70C is even better but then you get other "warping" like issues at the corners where they move inward but if you are desperate it's worth it. For ABS you want 110C (100C is good enough).

4) rounded corners - having square corners puts all the lifting force on a tiny spot. Rounding the corner spreads the force out more. This is optional if you use brim.

5) Brim - this is the most important of all. Turn on the brim feature in cura and do 10 passes of brim. This is awesome.

6) Squish - make sure the bottom layer is squishing onto the glass with no gaps in the brim. The first trace going down should be flat like a pancake, not rounded like string. don't run the leveling procedure if it is off, just turn the 3 screws the same amount while it is printing the skirt or brim. Counter clockwise from below gets the bed closer to the nozzle. Don't panic, take a breath, think about which way to move the glass, think about how the screw works, then twist. This may take 30 seconds but it's worth it to not rush it. You can always restart the print.

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They don't curl due to cooler temps, they curl there because that is where the forces are strongest.  The upper layers are pulling horizontally inward - the longer the distance the stronger the force.  Particularly read #6 below.  With blue tape instead of glass you also have to clean the blue tape with alcohol to remove waxy surface.  The problem you talk about still happens to people who don't know about the tricks below.

===

lifting corners, curling corners, part sticking to glass

1) Make sure the glass is clean if you haven't cleaned it for a few weeks.  You want a very thin coat of PVA glue which is found in hairspray, glue stick, wood glue.  If you use glue stick or wood glue you need to dilute it with water - about 5 to 10 parts water to 1 part glue.  So for example if you use glue stick, apply only to the outer edge of your model outline then add a tablespoon of water and spread with a tissue such that you thin it so much you can't see it anymore.  wood glue is better.  hairspray doesn't need to be diluted.  When it dries it should be invisible.  This glue works well for most plastics.

2) Heat the bed.  This helps the plastic fill in completely (no air pockets) so you have better contact with the glass.  For PLA any temp above 40C is safe.  I often print at 60C bed.

3) heat the bed (didn't I already say that?).  Keeping the bottom layers above the glass temp of the material makes it so the bottom layers can flex a bit (very very tiny amount) and relieve the tension/stress.  For PLA 60C is better than 50C.  70C is even better but then you get other "warping" like issues at the corners where they move inward but if you are desperate it's worth it.  For ABS you want 110C (100C is good enough).

4) rounded corners - having square corners puts all the lifting force on a tiny spot.  Rounding the corner spreads the force out more.  This is optional if you use brim.

5) Brim - this is the most important of all.  Turn on the brim feature in cura and do 10 passes of brim.  This is awesome.

6) Squish - make sure the bottom layer is squishing onto the glass with no gaps in the brim.  The first trace going down should be flat like a pancake, not rounded like string.  don't run the leveling procedure if it is off, just turn the 3 screws the same amount while it is printing the skirt or brim.  Counter clockwise from below gets the bed closer to the nozzle.  Don't panic, take a breath, think about which way to move the glass, think about how the screw works, then twist.  This may take 30 seconds but it's worth it to not rush it.  You can always restart the print.

 

Abs and heated bed when using the makerbot rep2x i run the bed at 130

ED

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