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Posted (edited) · Rotary Dual Print- Head

@johank and i were discussing a similar concept a bunch of years ago (just realized the pictures are from 2014...)

The main difference is that we did plan for the cold end to be water cooled to remove the heatsinks and fans and allow it to work inside a heated chamber.

u1jCmBt.png

Edited by Guest

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

3 nozzles ;) could be very nice to have! 2 nozzles with different diameter (small for the contur and the big one for filling) for the model and the third one for a water-soluble material. How did you want to trigger the rotation in 3 different positions?

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Posted (edited) · Rotary Dual Print- Head

We were sketching up different concepts, it started with a servo, but after a while we were more talking about putting neodymium magnets in the two bodies and putting a lever-construction it could run against a stop to push the head to either side, and to put it in the middle position it just pushed a shorter distance against the stop.

And yes, the three nozzles was for support + small + large nozzle or support + 2 colors

It was supposed to go on this modded ultimaker:

337px-Crowdfundedultimaker.jpg

Edited by Guest

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Mhm, lets call them "nozzle masks".

Yes, but i prefer a softer material like  high temperature silicon toned in a mold,  to prevent the nozzles for weareout. Trying to do only the standart retraction for the filament (except for the material which dont like to stay a bit longer in the nozzle).

I think most silicones will get hard and brittle, when exposed to hotter temps (250°C) for a longer time. Maybe you could also try *pure* aluminum, which is very, very soft? You can almost scratch it with a finger nail, and it is too soft to tap threads and screw bolts in it. Maybe try doing a scratch test between such pure aluminum and a brass nozzle (or whatever nozzle material you use), and verify under a microscope if it wears out?

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Meduza do you resume this project?, nice chamber for the UMO!

We were sketching up different concepts, it started with a servo, but after a while we were more talking about putting neodymium magnets in the two bodies and putting a lever-construction it could run against a stop to push the head to either side, and to put it in the middle position it just pushed a shorter distance against the stop.

And yes, the three nozzles was for support + small + large nozzle or support + 2 colors

It was supposed to go on this modded ultimaker:

337px-Crowdfundedultimaker.jpg

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Hi Geert,

i think aluminium will wear out / deform the brass nozzle over an averrage time too. I told my dad about my project and he had already the right silikon for it :p in his workshop. It`s a package of 3 special silikons from which i give the "Dirko HT (+315°C) " the first try (Link to special silicone). I already lay down a layer on a pla print, its sticks to it and its more like a realy soft rubber way more tough than normal silicon. If this doesn't work I'll come back to your idea :).

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Status update:

I mounted the printhead, the ramps and the new extruder on the UMO.

Rotary-Parts18.thumb.PNG.686857b276fcf31ccdb5012feb113861.PNG

Rotary-Parts19.thumb.PNG.102f236327ddd86d3c207e0262040334.PNG

Rotary-Parts20.thumb.PNG.70ab61a3b49e9aade383e2e4b654b7f0.PNG

But i got a difference between the CAD-modell and the real one which causes a print space lost.

Rotary-Parts21.thumb.PNG.12a4cfad55c061941c296030931d6cd2.PNG

I got some realy strange things with the marlin software... but in the end the printer was ready to run. But the e3d V6 / 24V version don't get enough power with the 19V (watched a youtube video in which it runs...) I simply put the orginal UMO heater in the e3d block. Sadly i broke the main part of the printhead at the lower linear- bearing... I glued it temporarily. Redisigned it much tougher, fixed the collision and right now I am printing it very slowly on the glued printhead ;).

Rotary-Parts22.thumb.PNG.2d5f9a812c76a3d85e08efb8ec642699.PNG

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Hi Geert,

i think aluminium will wear out / deform the brass nozzle over an averrage time too. I told my dad about my project and he had already the right silikon for it :Pin his workshop. It`s a package of 3 special silikons from which i give the "Dirko HT (+315°C) " the first try (Link to special silicone). I already lay down a layer on a pla print, its sticks to it and its more like a realy soft rubber way more tough than normal silicon. If this doesn't work I'll come back to your idea :).

Yes you are right. Try that first. When writing my remark, I had mould-making two-component silicones in mind, with an upper temp a bit above 200°C. Mine changed from very soft and a green color, into brittle and whitish. But I hadn't thought of these high temp moisture curing silicones for engine systems.

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

There is a two-part high temperature silicone available: Smooth-On Mold Max 60, which can withstand up to 294°C.

I have played around with high-temp red RTV silicone, but it is tricky to get it to cure with thick wall sections. One of the members here had recommended additives, such as corn flour, to improve curing however.

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Same thing to the silicon which i posted, they say that the max hight of the silicon should not overcome 3mm, but that have to be enough.

Little status update:

printed the spare printhead with e3d egde a nice material but I have to learn more about its proberties... printed the main body with the same tolerances like PLA, it all gets so tight that I spend hours for postprocessing it. Smaller parts (based on wrong print settings) gets serious layer bonding problems. But the main problem was that it wasnt stiff like the PLA print before, the steel balls penetrates the printed axial- bearing. In the end I overtightend it (to get it free of floating) and broke another parts of the printhead.

I am happy for the extra back up printhead which I printed before starting this project XD.

I'll print a stonger version of the last printhead in PLA and XT-CF20 (carbon fiber) this weekend.

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

@Zeno,

Have you considered using an off-the-shelf bearing instead of making your own? There are all kinds of choices of bearings for around 5USD each and you wouldn't have to worry about printing material choice, just make it a nice press fit in the PLA.

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Posted (edited) · Rotary Dual Print- Head

rowiac,

I don't look for a off-the-shelf bearing so far because I want to try out how much the 3D printer is possible to produce this mod on its own :).  The normal PLA performed perfect for this function (I could even double the count of the balls in the bearing to prevent penetration). The main issues comes from the early state of the design.

Edited by Guest

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Posted (edited) · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Hi there,

was a little bit busy in the last weeks thats why don't get realy further in this project. But i did a little practice in the open source cad programm "onshape" which is realy nice to work with. The main benefit to normal cad software is that it runs on many browsers (no install is necessary) and all the files you work on is in the cloud and it's free for open source projects :D.

The main body is much more durable and the overall movement is already finished.

Onshape1.thumb.PNG.deda3407096f9c47401621a6b8f155e2.PNG

Printhead 3D-Link

Complete Project 3D-Link

(this Links are always up-to-date thanks to the cloud architecture) feel free to leave me comments into onshape (registration)

Onshape1.thumb.PNG.deda3407096f9c47401621a6b8f155e2.PNG

Edited by Guest

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Hey. Great design !!! I wanted to do the same in the printer I am building, but the implementation in marlin code servo or electromagnetism me over. Can you tell me how you did it? Regards

Marcin

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Hey. Great design !!! I wanted to do the same in the printer I am building, but the implementation in marlin code servo or electromagnetism me over. Can you tell me how you did it? Regards

Marcin

Hi Marcin,

sorry for my late reaction, wasn´t working further in this project till now... I didn´t use an extra servo ore electro- magnet, the switch mechanism is triggered by the x and y axis of the printer outside the print- area (and fixed by perm- magnets). The movement for this switch- operation is put in the slicer with fixed ways for each tool call.

I can give you an example the next days.

Meanwhile i got the first test prints out of the new design :)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/2y3zbaanebivjyl/VID_20171212_230547.mp4?dl=0

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Hi Marcin,

 

here is an example of a g-code which i insert into the script for toolchange (s3d):

 

;*************************************************************

{IF NEWTOOL=0}G0 F10800 X60 Y170 ; Vorwechselposition TOOL0
{IF NEWTOOL=0}G0 F10800 X60 Y188 ; POS links vor Fahne
{IF NEWTOOL=0}G0 F6000 X86 Y188 ; schwenken
{IF NEWTOOL=0}G0 F10800 X81 Y188 ; entlasten
{IF NEWTOOL=0}G0 F10800 X81 Y170 ; Nachwechselposition

;*************************************************************

{IF NEWTOOL=1}G0 F10800 X125 Y170 ; Vorwechselposition TOOL1 Vorwechselposition TOOL1
{IF NEWTOOL=1}G0 F10800 X125 Y188 ; Vorwechselposition TOOL1 POS rechts vor Fahne
{IF NEWTOOL=1}G0 F6000 X93 Y188 ; Vorwechselposition TOOL1 schwenken
{IF NEWTOOL=1}G0 F10800 X98 Y188 ; Vorwechselposition TOOL1 entlasten
{IF NEWTOOL=1}G0 F10800 X98 Y170 ; Vorwechselposition TOOL1 Nachwechselposition

;*************************************************************

The slicer follow this g-code by each tool call and put it down directly in the g-code which is send to the printer.

 

Atached a slice of a dual print (first long time print test :) ):

 

5a3a8b1a5a2dd_DualPrint1.thumb.PNG.14a8083cedefba36c970982ef788ede7.PNG

 

5a3a8b405868b_DualPrint2.thumb.PNG.621fb6a1e970b756c80c107415677e0e.PNG

 

5a3a8bbb3e476_DualPrint5.thumb.PNG.37b18256700e06f206ca86d18ab8f678.PNG

 

5a3a8bd12def7_DualPrint4.thumb.PNG.4b4a66af476dc7709938324147633389.PNG

 

The movemant behind the actual print is to swap the printhead form side to side.

But you have to set an offset between the two toolheads (depends on your design) in the slicer ore in the firmware!

 

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Hi,

 

the current design is working fine but I am on a complete rework which keeps the good parts and replaces the bad parts.

 

current design:

 

 

R6.thumb.PNG.50277c0b76d94cc3c621035f35d1a04b.PNGR7.thumb.PNG.4aec6cb0f14e4112652b4948e71a4d14.PNGR5.thumb.PNG.53453a7025e4ebbfea3d637ad12bc6b9.PNGR4.thumb.PNG.fcbd5f54a26b2b010c22d2a627324be1.PNGR3.thumb.PNG.a75988eba577d44fca6196239502e49a.PNGR2.thumb.PNG.c503550ff751b9a665c803f9467a1e0b.PNGR1.thumb.PNG.066addae78e524a3fc620e0ebe3fa5d2.PNG

 

If you want this current design let me know (without desciption...)

The final design will be more steady,usable print space for dual exrusion will be 190mm X 200mm Y 200mm Z, and the very noisy 30mm fans will be replaced with bigger and quiter fans.

 

Zeno

 

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Sadly I got a nozzle jam on the left Extruder with the red PLA...  I lll surch for the reason of this error and try it again.

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Posted (edited) · Rotary Dual Print- Head

The print failed because of a commbination of too low temperature and too fast retraction speed (35/mms) for the toolchange, when the tool call 0 comes (pla) the extruder grinded the fillement away...

 

here some photos of the print:

 

DSC04707.thumb.JPG.598eb6fbec14d5193ee3ef3f852f7d74.JPG

 

DSC04706.thumb.JPG.db32b607942ca95d1d0548780ccc51fe.JPG

 

DSC04710.thumb.JPG.51d97d334ca9a7005ff74dc992e49064.JPG

 

DSC04713.thumb.JPG.391fbd40a49c43b5233c1e5b01cc5114.JPG

 

For the next try I changed the retraction speed for the toolchange to 15/mms, the set the temp a little bit up, deactivate the raft and change the support to 10% and 45°

 

DSC04714.thumb.JPG.adbffd0d9cfac40a905e54b0ffb2123f.JPG

 

DSC04715.thumb.JPG.90ad12f13709c62ac10a81e78f3a08cd.JPG

 

printing right now:

 

Twitch Livestream

 

Several fails later I changed the modell material to Solid Edge (Black)

(I have to do some testprints with pla with planed stop times first)

 

Edited by Zeno

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Posted · Rotary Dual Print- Head

Hi there! just landed on this forum... congratulations!
The last post is on january 2018 hope someone is still interested on it!
I'm writing you becouse I've decided to work on a similar project for my UMO (two nozzle swop their height via a rotation).
In order to trig the rotation the print head needs to do a specific movement every time it passes from a nozzle to the other and viceversa... nothing new.. exactly the same concept with a different shape.
here the simulation:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/kys2yq4jwg9nflb/rotary-double-nozzle2.gif?dl=0
As I've understood you just insert a GCode strip for it... no mod on firmware nor low level programming... that souns awesome to me!
Could you please explain me a little more? how the GCode works? where should I write them? (I use cura) and how to customize for my specific movement?
For what I know I can make some modification to the start-Gcode and End-Gcode in the machine setting in Cura (screenshoot attached)... but I really don't know if it is helpful and if so what shoul Iwrite.
thank you!Hi there

Schermata 2019-05-15 alle 19.38.12.png

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