Support structure starts in mid air (slicing bug?)

[BlackCloud 1]

Is this a bug? This is layer 343 in a print. You can see the start of a support line suspended in mid air.

 

 

Here it is at layer 346. It's starting to grow towards the other support but it's still in the middle of the air

 

It finally joins the other support structure at layer 367.


Clearly this doesn't print. You get 24 layers of spaghetti then it *might* adhere to the remaining support and recover enough strength to actually support the remaining print.

For background, this is the model I am trying to print. Obviously a good support structure is critical.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2255905

 

 

 

Edited March 24, 2018 by BlackCloud
added help tag and link to the model I am trying to print.

[BlackCloud 1]

Hello? Anybody? Any thoughts on how to work around this? Or figure out what the problem is?

[BlackCloud 1]

Come folks. Did I not describe the problem clearly?

Does anyone from Ultimaker haunt this place? 

 

Is there another slicer that supports a UM3?

[kmanstudios 1,120]

3 hours ago, BlackCloud said:

Come folks. Did I not describe the problem clearly?

Does anyone from Ultimaker haunt this place? 

 

Is there another slicer that supports a UM3?

Kinda a bit anxious there? I am here all the time, more or less, and I just saw this. So, yes, people 'haunt' the place.

Here is the thing, did you try to print and what happened if you did? I have seen this many times and did not have any issuese.

 

You are obviously playing a bit with support. Try and change density or remove the gradual steps. Do not freak out. If you are new, sometimes you just gotta jump off the cliff and see what happens.

Edited April 7, 2018 by kmanstudios

[BlackCloud 1]

Anxious? No. But no response after 10 days is usually a bad sign.

I've done a number of test prints and this part of the model doesn't work properly. It literally prints in the air. I've tried changing the density and other parameters for the support and other problems happen. The fact that that part of all the tests failed is what made me look so closely at the slicing.

[XYZDesignPro 70]

I downloaded your part and sliced it using the default 0.15 Layer Height settings except I checked the box to Generate Support and chose Extruder 2 for the Support Extruder.  I do not see the same result as you are describing.:

 

What layer height are you set at?  My build time is shown as 14h 34min.  Is that what you are getting?

 

 

Edited April 7, 2018 by XYZDesignPro
Removed one of the images

[kmanstudios 1,120]

3 hours ago, BlackCloud said:

Anxious? No. But no response after 10 days is usually a bad sign.

I've done a number of test prints and this part of the model doesn't work properly. It literally prints in the air. I've tried changing the density and other parameters for the support and other problems happen. The fact that that part of all the tests failed is what made me look so closely at the slicing.

10 days? As I said, I am here all the time. I had just seen it when I posted. So, I am thinking that happened with others as well.

[BlackCloud 1]

3 hours ago, XYZDesignPro said:

What layer height are you set at?  My build time is shown as 14h 34min.  Is that what you are getting?

 

 

I'm using layer height of .06. Print time is 36 hours.

 

I've tried all the different support patterns and they all do this though in slightly different spots.

At 0.15 layer height it doesn't do it. At 0.1 it does but not so badly that it won't join up with the other support after a few layers.

[XYZDesignPro 70]

Changed nothing from the default settings I outlined above except for layer height 0.15 to 0.06.  Here's what I get at Layer 346.  Everything is pretty much attached to something.  The default support settings are Everywhere, 45°, Triangles at 50%.

 

Buils time is 35h 4 minutes.  Hope you have a generous supply of PVA.  

Hope this helps . . .

[kmanstudios 1,120]

I am getting the same thing. I have no idea where those support styles he showed came from. I am using Cura 3.2 to check this out.

[BlackCloud 1]

Curiouser and curiouser.

So nobody else is seeing this weirdness? I'll try it XYZDesignPro's settings.

[BlackCloud 1]

Using the settings suggested, there is a very small anomaly at layer 344. Changing the support density to 25% makes the problem worse. This screen shot is 60 degree overhang and 25% support density. The second shot is 60 degree overhang and 50% density. Both at layer 343.

I am thinking of splitting the model into three pieces so I can use less support. But this section underneath the arm is a problem regardless.

 

 

[XYZDesignPro 70]

Your model is already in 4 parts on Thingiverse.  Seems you really making this project a "project" . . .

 

In any case, I can appreciate where 25% support density would make the problem worse, but at 50% I suspect that even though you do have a stranded support segment at layer 343 the next layer or two above that will probably bridge the gap because, unlike 25%, the support structure is so much closer together.  Everything above that should be fine.

 

Try starting the print a layer 300 or so, and you won't have to waste filament and time?

 

Also, was there some reason why you reverted back to 60° support overhang?

[BlackCloud 1]

14 minutes ago, XYZDesignPro said:

Your model is already in 4 parts on Thingiverse.  Seems you really making this project a "project" . . .

 

In any case, I can appreciate where 25% support density would make the problem worse, but at 50% I suspect that even though you do have a stranded support segment at layer 343 the next layer or two above that will probably bridge the gap because, unlike 25%, the support structure is so much closer together.  Everything above that should be fine.

 

Try starting the print a layer 300 or so, and you won't have to waste filament and time?

 

Also, was there some reason why you reverted back to 60° support overhang?

 

Project of a project - like that never happens when 3D printing.

How do I start a print at a particular layer? Edit the gcode?

I've had models print fine with 60 degree overhang. Not sure this is going to be one of them. Too many weird protuberances.

[kmanstudios 1,120]

60° overhang is my default starting point. Do you have all your settings turned on/unhidden?

[kmanstudios 1,120]

I am not getting the same results. So I have to ask:

1. What slicer/version are you using?
2. What position/angle are you placing object on build plate?

I am using the following:

1. Cura 3.2 so that I am not using a beta, but the regular old Cura everybody has used and is stable.
2. Imported object and just rotated 180° to have it facing outside of buildplate.

This is what I get at your layer from above.

[XYZDesignPro 70]

On 4/7/2018 at 4:28 PM, BlackCloud said:

 

Project of a project - like that never happens when 3D printing.

How do I start a print at a particular layer? Edit the gcode?

I've had models print fine with 60 degree overhang. Not sure this is going to be one of them. Too many weird protuberances.

 To start the print at at a place other than the actual bottom of the part, just select the model, then select the Move tool in the upper left of the screen.  Grab the blue arrow and drag the model down into the build plate. 

 

Edited April 9, 2018 by XYZDesignPro
Added the image

[Hudson 2]

I'm having a similar issue, and ran across your post.

 

 Any chance you are using a single extruder for model and support?   XYZ and Kman both used a dual extrusion setup. 

 

I am trying to print with Hytrel and Dupont recommends using itself as the support material.  I tried to print with the settings from the market place and it was ok but not the best.  Looking back to Cura and playing with support settings, it tries printing support in mid air (even with a "support bottom distance" of 0)  

[BlackCloud 1]

6 hours ago, Hudson said:

I'm having a similar issue, and ran across your post.

 

 Any chance you are using a single extruder for model and support?   XYZ and Kman both used a dual extrusion setup. 

 

I was using PVA for support PLA for the item. I don't remember exactly what I did to get a good print. It was never perfect for that one spot, but good enough. I took a lot of trial and error and tweaking the support settings. I loaded up the model into Blender and chopped it up to isolate the trouble spot and worked on that so I didn't have to print any more than necessary.

[Knochi 0]

Hi,

 

I have the same issues here. Tried several options for support with no satisfying result.

This is how it's done in default "triangles support".

 

Cura 4.1

0.15mm layer height

PVA support

Angle 60°