Cursing does probably not speed up things at @Ultimaker. I think e.g. @SandervG has probably already passed the request on to the right people or could give an advise here who to tag for this.
I apologize if a previous post by me made someone think the issue was ressolved and led to a disappointment; I edited that post in the meantime. Please be aware I do not work at Ultimaker; so please do not blame them for that wrong statement.
Edited by Dim3nsioneerI can partly understand that some people would like to have a better light control to configure the light situation as they want. But on the other side, it's just a LED stripe, which makes light. No restrictions in print quality or other bugs that make the printer unusable.
Full control over several light situations will probably never come, so what will happen, in the next (hopefully) firmware release, we will get the possibility to switch off the light entirely like the UM3, instead of just a very low dimmed light. But I don't think, that more features will come in future firmware releases. UM produces printers, not light shows, like Philips HUE and it would be a lot of effort to make everyone happy if they make the light scenes and situations fully configurable. For me, it is more important that they put the resources in their core business, which is 3D printing.
If for someone a very dimmed light is a show stopper to go with the S5, then there is always the possibility to disconnect the LED stripe entirely or put a switch in the cable, leave the lights on always for 100% and you can decide when you want to switch it on or off.
I know we could argue, that a printer in this price range has to have such features out of the box and it is not acceptable. But I also would repurchase this printer if there are no lights at all because I bought it because of all the other 3D printing features.
So finally I want to say, yes it is sad, that the function is not included in the latest release, but it is nothing which stops us from using the printer. The possibility to switch the LED completely off will come, I am sure UM listens to us, but as @Dim3nsioneer already said, just blaming will not help and make things faster.
Just my 2 cents....
On 11/5/2018 at 7:37 AM, Bigbrit said:Super disappointed to read this guys.
Mine lives in my garage and even at lowest light lights the whole thing up so that anybody can see from the outside that there is something going on in there.
Ultimaker - you need to get the details right!
I think they either fail to grasp what customers expect at this price point or just do not care. Either way it's extremely disappointing.
Hi Everyone, thank you for all the feedback. Due to the intensity of some of these responses I suspect not everyone is experiencing the same intended behavior. @Bigbrit, can you share a video or photo of what your garage looks like when the LEDs are off?
The bug that was fixed in the firmware was a bug that some printers did not respond when you moved the sliding bar to the far left (off) on the Ultimaker S5 display, so LEDs stayed on at 100%. This is fixed, meaning, the sliding bar should work for everyone. Small nuance, when the slider bar is to the far left the LEDs are not 100% off, I think they might be on for 1% or less.
When I just checked, I didn't even see they were still on except when I held my hand entirely against the frame I saw a faint glow. Is this glow what you are talking about @Shadowman ? I think the lights of the print cores are probably brighter.
Next there is also an option to select 'Only on while printing', which means that the LEDs are on until you click 'confirm print removal' on the display.
Based on this discussion I think it's good to validate some definitions and scenarios.
When the LEDs are off, but glow minimally by 1%, is this troublesome for anyone?
If you want to prove a point, photo's would be much appreciated.
If so, in which scenario? I read somewhere office security might have an issue with it. In this case, would it make more sense to turn off the LEDs yourself anyway? If 'on while printing' would be enabled, there is a fair chance the LEDs would still be on anyway when you run a multi-day print.
And generally, in which scenario do you feel the LEDs are not supporting your needs?
Looking forward hearing from you, and apologies if the 'LEDs are fixed in the firmware'-statement was confusing. I understand we might have been talking about different behavior/bug.
2
5 hours ago, Dim3nsioneer said:Cursing does probably not speed up things at @Ultimaker. I think e.g. @SandervG has probably already passed the request on to the right people or could give an advise here who to tag for this.
I apologize if a previous post by me made someone think the issue was ressolved and led to a disappointment; I edited that post in the meantime. Please be aware I do not work at Ultimaker; so please do not blame them for that wrong statement.
No worries as it was Ultimaker that indicated that the LEDs would finally be able to be turned off.
Takes care
2 hours ago, SandervG said:
Hi Everyone, thank you for all the feedback. Due to the intensity of some of these responses I suspect not everyone is experiencing the same intended behavior. @Bigbrit, can you share a video or photo of what your garage looks like when the LEDs are off?
The bug that was fixed in the firmware was a bug that some printers did not respond when you moved the sliding bar to the far left (off) on the Ultimaker S5 display, so LEDs stayed on at 100%. This is fixed, meaning, the sliding bar should work for everyone. Small nuance, when the slider bar is to the far left the LEDs are not 100% off, I think they might be on for 1% or less.
When I just checked, I didn't even see they were still on except when I held my hand entirely against the frame I saw a faint glow. Is this glow what you are talking about @Shadowman ? I think the lights of the print cores are probably brighter.
Next there is also an option to select 'Only on while printing', which means that the LEDs are on until you click 'confirm print removal' on the display.
Based on this discussion I think it's good to validate some definitions and scenarios.
When the LEDs are off, but glow minimally by 1%, is this troublesome for anyone?
If you want to prove a point, photo's would be much appreciated.
If so, in which scenario? I read somewhere office security might have an issue with it. In this case, would it make more sense to turn off the LEDs yourself anyway? If 'on while printing' would be enabled, there is a fair chance the LEDs would still be on anyway when you run a multi-day print.
And generally, in which scenario do you feel the LEDs are not supporting your needs?
Looking forward hearing from you, and apologies if the 'LEDs are fixed in the firmware'-statement was confusing. I understand we might have been talking about different behavior/bug.
Good day SandervG
To make clear again;
1. The “only on when printing” option does not turn the LEDs off when not printing; it only dims them.
2. When the LEDs are dimmed the printer luminates the entire dark room; it simply needs to be able to be turned off.
Thank You
2 hours ago, SandervG said:
Hi Everyone, thank you for all the feedback. Due to the intensity of some of these responses I suspect not everyone is experiencing the same intended behavior. @Bigbrit, can you share a video or photo of what your garage looks like when the LEDs are off?
The bug that was fixed in the firmware was a bug that some printers did not respond when you moved the sliding bar to the far left (off) on the Ultimaker S5 display, so LEDs stayed on at 100%. This is fixed, meaning, the sliding bar should work for everyone. Small nuance, when the slider bar is to the far left the LEDs are not 100% off, I think they might be on for 1% or less.
When I just checked, I didn't even see they were still on except when I held my hand entirely against the frame I saw a faint glow. Is this glow what you are talking about @Shadowman ? I think the lights of the print cores are probably brighter.
Next there is also an option to select 'Only on while printing', which means that the LEDs are on until you click 'confirm print removal' on the display.
Based on this discussion I think it's good to validate some definitions and scenarios.
When the LEDs are off, but glow minimally by 1%, is this troublesome for anyone?
If you want to prove a point, photo's would be much appreciated.
If so, in which scenario? I read somewhere office security might have an issue with it. In this case, would it make more sense to turn off the LEDs yourself anyway? If 'on while printing' would be enabled, there is a fair chance the LEDs would still be on anyway when you run a multi-day print.
And generally, in which scenario do you feel the LEDs are not supporting your needs?
Looking forward hearing from you, and apologies if the 'LEDs are fixed in the firmware'-statement was confusing. I understand we might have been talking about different behavior/bug.
Hello,
Glad you chime in.
I am the guy with the security problem (at this moment with my UM3)
It is plain simple.
For me the ideal solution is (for UM3 and S5):
Led on for xx minutes (like 10 or so, settings in menu) and after this time dimming to 0 (maybe 1%, would have to test this on a new S5)
Then after this xx minutes, when the leds are dimmed, switch them back on by touching the panel, or in case of the UM3 rotating the knob.
This is the actual working situation on my UM2+ (mark2), works wonderfull.
If you can't achive this, i will have to put a switch between the led strips.
My S5 will be printing big jobs for several days.
Many thanks ?
Edited by RudydG3 hours ago, Smithy said:
I know we could argue, that a printer in this price range has to have such features out of the box and it is not acceptable.
Hello Smithy,
Understanding your point, but, I don't think you fully realise what the impact of this situation is. I really have a problem with this, my desk is at the side of a parking place, i have to close my rolling curtains, and even then, it is still visible from streetlevel, i have to explain to the secury guard, and my fellow workers don't consider me "eco-friendly" because my working space is always lit.
So for me it is a big deal. Surely for a machine of this pricelevel.
Greetings,
Rudy
1 minute ago, RudydG said:Hello Smithy,
Understanding your point, but, I don't think you fully realise what the impact of this situation is. I really have a problem with this, my desk is at the side of a parking place, i have to close my rolling curtains, and even then, it is still visible from streetlevel, i have to explain to the secury guard, and my fellow workers don't consider me "eco-friendly" because my working space is always lit.
So for me it is a big deal. Surely for a machine of this pricelevel.
Greetings,
Rudy
"eco friendly" because of a few watts max? Surely your fellow workers arrive by bicycle? Or are they using their hundreds-of-kilowatts cars to do this? (Sorry, OT, but I'm fed up with people that are self-proclaimedly "eco-aware" and nitpicky about turning off the lights, but make a weekend trip somewhere by plane without even thinking)
BTT: An option like the one you mentioned would indeed be very welcome.
18 minutes ago, RudydG said:it is still visible from streetlevel, i have to explain to the secury guard
It's just an idea, but doesn't have the S5 the same API as the UM3?
One can control the pre-heating and the main lights of the UM3 with small python scripts (amongst other things). It would not be very handy for a big printer farm, but works great for single printers.
Though, this needs a running computer instead of a simple switch... ?
Not sure, if this is still possible on the S5... but if, would this be an option?
4 hours ago, SandervG said:
Hi Everyone, thank you for all the feedback. Due to the intensity of some of these responses I suspect not everyone is experiencing the same intended behavior. @Bigbrit, can you share a video or photo of what your garage looks like when the LEDs are off?
The bug that was fixed in the firmware was a bug that some printers did not respond when you moved the sliding bar to the far left (off) on the Ultimaker S5 display, so LEDs stayed on at 100%. This is fixed, meaning, the sliding bar should work for everyone. Small nuance, when the slider bar is to the far left the LEDs are not 100% off, I think they might be on for 1% or less.
When I just checked, I didn't even see they were still on except when I held my hand entirely against the frame I saw a faint glow. Is this glow what you are talking about @Shadowman ? I think the lights of the print cores are probably brighter.
Next there is also an option to select 'Only on while printing', which means that the LEDs are on until you click 'confirm print removal' on the display.
Based on this discussion I think it's good to validate some definitions and scenarios.
When the LEDs are off, but glow minimally by 1%, is this troublesome for anyone?
If you want to prove a point, photo's would be much appreciated.
If so, in which scenario? I read somewhere office security might have an issue with it. In this case, would it make more sense to turn off the LEDs yourself anyway? If 'on while printing' would be enabled, there is a fair chance the LEDs would still be on anyway when you run a multi-day print.
And generally, in which scenario do you feel the LEDs are not supporting your needs?
Looking forward hearing from you, and apologies if the 'LEDs are fixed in the firmware'-statement was confusing. I understand we might have been talking about different behavior/bug.
Ok I will send you some photos when I return to the UK on Monday. You will see exactly what the issue is straight away I am sure.
1 hour ago, tinkergnome said:It's just an idea, but doesn't have the S5 the same API as the UM3?
One can control the pre-heating and the main lights of the UM3 with small python scripts (amongst other things). It would not be very handy for a big printer farm, but works great for single printers.
Though, this needs a running computer instead of a simple switch... ?
Not sure, if this is still possible on the S5... but if, would this be an option?
Just checked it and yes, it is the same API and you have full control via the API to the LEDs. So a simple request and you can switch on/off, change brightness, colors and so on.
With a Raspberry PI there would be a lot of possibilities. A simple switch is possible but then you could also use a normal switch, but could be controlled by time or maybe combined with an PIR to switch on when someone is near the printer or ??? . There are a lot of possibilities.
If the solution should be just time based, then it should be possible to do it on the stock UM board and run a cronjob there.
1 hour ago, RudydG said:Understanding your point, but, I don't think you fully realise what the impact of this situation is. I really have a problem with this, my desk is at the side of a parking place, i have to close my rolling curtains, and even then, it is still visible from streetlevel, i have to explain to the secury guard, and my fellow workers don't consider me "eco-friendly" because my working space is always lit.
So for me it is a big deal. Surely for a machine of this pricelevel.
Hello Rudy
I believe it is a big deal for you, otherwise you would not mention it here. But the behavior of your UM2+ is not with the stock firmware, because these timeout features come with the Tinkergome firmware or not?
As written in my previous post, the LED can be controlled via the API of the printer. So what I want to check now is, if I can find a possibility in the code of the printer, to catch an event when touching the display or turning the knob on the UM3. If it is easy to get such an event, then a little script which would run on the printer itself could achieve your requirements. But that needs a little bit of research because I am familiar with python but not with the implementation of it on the UM3 and S5.
This has become an interesting thread.
The ECO mode comments when associated with a dimmed LED should be of little concern as the milliamp draw is negligible at best nonetheless, for some as indicated within this thread it is a real issue.
As stated earlier; it is simply the act of not having the printer glowing as if a display piece in a window 24/7; there simply is no reason.
When the S5 was initially received I questioned why when the “on only when printing” option was selected did it not in fact turn the LEDs off but rather they simply reduced to glowing; this based on what someone else felt was appropriate; I was told that it was a bug to be resolved in the next firmware; it was not.
As with most folks we have many pieces of hardware that have activity lighting however, they all go off and or are able to be turned of at will; this sure seems like a no brainer to me.
As a poor nonetheless real example; within and around your home, computer screen, other printers, your stove light, microwave light, washer and dryer lights, your TV, your vanity lights, your room lights, your outside “night” lighting, even your TV remote will stop luminating when not being used, etc.. None of these items remain on 24/7 aka constantly.
It simply make no sense.
Furthemore; the option within the menu is “on only when printing” as such by the very words used means “off” when not printing.
Now I understand that for some having the glow of the printer throughout the day and night is cool; then within the code it can allow for “on only when printing” as the option indicates now or “glow when not printing”.
As I said; this is truly an interesting thread.
Edited by Shadowman
1
1 minute ago, Smithy said:Hello Rudy
I believe it is a big deal for you, otherwise you would not mention it here. But the behavior of your UM2+ is not with the stock firmware, because these timeout features come with the Tinkergome firmware or not?
As written in my previous post, the LED can be controlled via the API of the printer. So what I want to check now is, if I can find a possibility in the code of the printer, to catch an event when touching the display or turning the knob on the UM3. If it is easy to get such an event, then a little script which would run on the printer itself could achieve your requirements. But that needs a little bit of research because I am familiar with python but not with the implementation of it on the UM3 and S5.
Indeed, i use the Tinkerware firmware, but i think for someone who builds 3d printers, develop firmwares, Cura software, we can assume that this basic reature should be a piece of cake.
Personaly i build machines, and i can tell you, listening to the operators, and the user interface is the most important piece of my development. And the smallest thing for me, can be a major annoyance for someone else.
1 minute ago, RudydG said:listening to the operators, and the user interface is the most important piece of my development.
I think it will go in the right direction now. That's why Sander was asking for specific requirements to understand the source and background about the issue.
20 minutes ago, Smithy said:I think it will go in the right direction now. That's why Sander was asking for specific requirements to understand the source and background about the issue.
Humm.
As much as I appreciate the support from SandervG and the Develoment Team there is a bit of a two step going on here; I say two step because of the following.
Now let me make clear that I mean not to promote an argument and yet I am not good with inconsistencies in the story. I expect continuity to that which is shared from the beginning to the end.
Now as for why the LED situation is important to some and benign and even invisible to others is not the issue nor should it matter.
As such I share the following;
Over a month ago SandervG and I communicated independent of the thread about the LEDs; I was told that it was a known issue to be resolved in the next firmware update.
Below is a portion of my conversation with him;
”1. The frame light remains on 24/7. It is bright while printing and then once we confirm that we have removed the object from the build plate the leds go dim but do not turn off. “
”This leaves only the led lights (a minor issue) that you and your team are acknowledging and the FW updating issues.”
Edited by Shadowman
If its easy to implement on the Printer I see no reason to not have an LED OFF function. Thats all I want - the ability to turn the LED's off...
Edited by Bigbrit
This is what my S5 is like in a dark room when the frame lights and display are both on the min setting to the left. Why I don’t personally have a problem to much my self I can understand why some do because if something is making a room light up and it can be seen even more if from street level then the wrong type of people might get the idea to try and “borrow” that S5
@Carla_Birch Your S5 is clearly affected by the led bug that has been fixed in the current firmware (or should be). If you are already on firmware version 5.1.7, please perform a Cura connect reset and check the brightness settings again.
That's right, this is too bright for the lowest setting.
BTW: I have checked the code yesterday a little bit and I am not sure if this behavior is so a small issue. Because I found the definitions about the led settings and there is WHITE and BLACK and so on, and I assume that if you say LED off when not printing, the LEDs will switch to the predefined BLACK profile, which should be off but is in fact still very low dimmed.
So it could be, that the printer software wants to turn it off completely, but for whatever reason, it isn't. I will double check it the next days, if it is possible to turn off the LED completely via the API or if the absolutely minimum there s also just low dimmed.
8 hours ago, Dim3nsioneer said:@Carla_Birch Your S5 is clearly affected by the led bug that has been fixed in the current firmware (or should be). If you are already on firmware version 5.1.7, please perform a Cura connect reset and check the brightness settings again.
Just got a few day print going right now so will have to try reset after that prints done. But i was thinking the led bug fixed was just the one where the led would not react to the slider? My led reacts to the slider and thats how bright they are on the lowest setting.
Thats the printer on full brightness in a dark room., vs the below (what i posted above) on the min setting
2 hours ago, Carla_Birch said:Just got a few day print going right now so will have to try reset after that prints done. But i was thinking the led bug fixed was just the one where the led would not react to the slider? My led reacts to the slider and thats how bright they are on the lowest setting.
Thats the printer on full brightness in a dark room., vs the below (what i posted above) on the min setting
Mine is exactly as yours; I have installed the new firmware.
My slider function also operates fine.
Both the max bright and min bright pictures are as mine.
The Leds need to be able to be turned off as desired and without a doubt; off when not printing.
Edited by ShadowmanSign me up for this too. At the very least, the LED should go out when its done printing, not stay on until after i hit confirm removal. If i have a print that finishes at Friday at 7pm, I dont want the printer light on at full blast all weekend. A setting of "upon print completion" with a 3 step slider with settings of "off" "dim" and "flash" would be great.
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SandervG
Hi Everyone, thank you for all the feedback. Due to the intensity of some of these responses I suspect not everyone is experiencing the same intended behavior. @Bigbrit, can you share a video or photo
Shadowman
This has become an interesting thread. The ECO mode comments when associated with a dimmed LED should be of little concern as the milliamp draw is negligible at best nonetheless, for some
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Shadowman 53
My thoughts were conveyed to Ultimaker on day one.... then assured that the situation was resolved ... here we are still no change.
Disappinted would imply that I understand however, I don’t, as such I am so far beyond disappointed and have entered the world of, dare I say; WTF!!!
Ugh.........
Edited by ShadowmanSpelling
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