S5 direct drive conversion for ninjaflex material

[ultiarjan 1,223]

 

I was looking into a way to occasionally print Ninjaflex or other real flexible materials (85A)
There's no way you'll be doing that reliable with a bowden setup (ok, I've seen people using oil in the bowden but nahhh), so I compared a quick and dirty direct drive conversion on an Ultimaker2 head (tested on my DIY GO) and on the ultimaker S5

 

 

     ****
first a warning, Ultimaker does NOT want you to open the S5, it contains an open style high voltage power supply, so it's DANGEROUS!!!, also the electronics can be damaged and I'm pretty sure you loose your warranty.  

     ****

 

I used two materials for testing, Extrudr TPU Soft and Ninjaflex, both 85A.

 

I used the regular feeder from the UM2+ , combined with a pancake stepper motor (LDO-42STH25-1404MAC#190920) this stepper is less than half the weight of the normal stepper. I had to cut some length of the shaft to make it fit. The stepper has a different # steps per rotation and as it's impossible to change the steps setting for the S5 on one feeder it needs compensation in flow (200% flow = 100%)

 

Obviously the result is a crazy top heavy setup, but if you just want to print an occasional gasket it should be fine, specially since you need to print materials this flexible very slow (15 mm/s) anyhow. On an Ultimaker2 the extra weight is enormous, on the S5 not so much as it's very heavy already anyhow.

 

 

The nice thing is you can see into the feeder so during testing it's easy to spot when the feeder can't cope if you try to speed it up to much. If something goes wrong it's mainly during the first few layers, so watch them... otherwise you'll spend a few minutes again taking the feeder apart...

To validate the basic setup I printed regular PLA on both converted machines, to make sure the setup (including changed steps/flow due to different motor) was correct.

 

On the UM2 head the ninjaflex was pretty easy to get working, i managed to print with constant and reliable extrusion using a 0.4 nozzle.

The materials prints best around (I tested with 0.15 layers)

Flow :         110-115 % (with  feeder tension set to lowest point)
Temperature :    210 c
Speed : 15 to 20 mm/s

The easiest way to test temperature and flow is by printing simple cilinders, foir the S5 you can use the "tune" menu to play with values on the fly.

 

 

 

Getting ninjaflex to work on the S5 proved to be more difficult than on the UM2, at the same settings using an 0.4 mm nozzle prints failed all the time, it seems the CORE, is much more of a challenge that a UM2 setup. I blame the longer filament path, and the metal tube of the core. Only when I changed to the 0.8 nozzle and the CC0.6 I was able to get reliable results.

My main S5 tests are with the CC0.6, atm my best results are with the following settings;

 

The S5 levels pretty close to the bed, making every print fail at normal flow rates.

Layer height 0,15
Initial layer height 0,25

Top/bottom pattern & Innitial layer pattern ; concentric (avoid lot's of small lines, head vibration)

Innitial printing temperature/ innitial layer : 230c
Printing teperature : 215c

Skirt/Brim flow 140% (= realy 70%, due to the different stepper motor)
Innitial layer flow 150% (= realy 75%, due to the different stepper motor)
Flow 225%  (= 2x the real flow, due to the different stepper motor)

Print speed 15 mm/s
Innitial layer speed, Skirt/Brim speed 10mm/s

Cooling at 100%, start with 20% and let it rise over 10 layers)

 

Turn off the flow sensor (in the settings menu) on the S5, as you're not using that feeder..

 

Conclusion, even if you eliminate the bowden, printing 85A flex on an Ultimaker S5 is still a bit of a challenge. The used feeder (UM2+UM3 model) and filament path are not ideal. But, usually if you make it past the first few layers, and have relatively simple prints that keep the flow going it's very well possible to print ninjaflex on the S5.

 

I have not experimented a lot with it jet, but I also managed a simple test print using PLA for support on the 2th extruder.

 

the hardware hack;

The feeder plate mounts to 3 screws of the head, so you can leave one and the head will stay assembled during mounting.

I made a little breakout plug for the left stepper motor on the back of the printer, so I can change between direct and bowden in just a few minutes. I just leave the black mounting plate on the head. In needed to make a hole in the bottom plate for the DIY extension cable. I isolated the plug with hot glue. 

some side notes;
Cura can sometimes create fantastic vibrator g-codes, not nice with this heavy setup, so one thing you can do to prevent this is  to change line fill to cylindrical fill, and check the layer preview.

 

ninjaflex openRC wheel, printed on S5

 

extrudr TPU soft (85A just like ninjaflex) gasket, printed on S5

 

S5 stl's

S5_FlexDirect.zip

 

 

 

[GAD 10]

Now that's a cool post. Thanks for sharing!

[mkaj2019 41]

Great mod! How far could you reduce the retraction distance with your mod?

 

Quote

The S5 levels pretty close to the bed, making every print fail at normal flow rates.

 

Have you tried using the the Z offset Plugin from the Cura Marketplace.

[ultiarjan 1,223]

5 hours ago, mkaj2019 said:

Great mod! How far could you reduce the retraction distance with your mod?

 

I only used flex material, though direct drive is obviously beneficial for retraction behavior, I feel the added weight of this hack is so bad that it doesn't make any sense to look at other materials. 

 

5 hours ago, mkaj2019 said:

Have you tried using the the Z offset Plugin from the Cura Marketplace.

 

I did not, but I think it's basically another means to achieve the same, weather you reduce flow at the same height, or increase height at the same flow, the result is avoiding to much pressure build up.

 

[arktape 2]

On 3/1/2020 at 12:51 PM, ultiarjan said:

to change line fill to cylindrical fill

 

Where do you find this?

[LeonardoFlorianAMG3D 2]

@ultiarjan: this looks like our first prototype back in 2018 on our Ultimaker 3!

 

With ours you can print ninjaflex and PVA together without any oozing 🙂

Works with S5, S3, S5 PRO Bundle.

 

Hope you like it! Let me know if anyone wants to know more. 

 

Leonardo Florian

 

Edited June 22, 2021 by SandervG
Comply with code of conduct

[LeonardoFlorianAMG3D 2]

On 3/4/2021 at 4:13 PM, arktape said:

 

Where do you find this?

In Cura.

Here:

 

[gtrmike92 0]

@LeonardoFlorianAMG3D im highly interested in that setup you have id happily pay for the files/instructions. let me know

[LordHokage 7]

2 hours ago, gtrmike92 said:

@LeonardoFlorianAMG3D im highly interested in that setup you have id happily pay for the files/instructions. let me know

I am too! Out of curiousity, would this work with a UMO+ ?

[gtrmike92 0]

@LordHokage did some research and found the company website for purchase www.amg3d.com

[LeonardoFlorianAMG3D 2]

Hello @gtrmike92,

Great! 

Here's a cool .gif or a recent print with AMG3D Direct Drive + TPU Ultimaker + PVA Ultimaker.

 

@LordHokage,

Unfortunately it is compatible only with UMS3 and UMS5 as they have stiffer print head axes.

 

Edited June 28, 2021 by LeonardoFlorianAMG3D

[ultiarjan 1,223]

Hi @LeonardoFlorianAMG3D I had totally missed your post.  I'm curious of your setup, can you share a picture of the back? Did you really add dual motors? that must be a hefty weight increase, they don't look like pancakes? Whats the total added  weight of your setup?

 

I see you offer your "hack" for a whopping 750,-  brave move 🙂 

Does you setup provide any quick way to convert back to original? asking as I think (due to the massive weight increase) for probably everything but ninjaflex you're better of with the original setup...

 

Did you get any reliable results with ninjaflex and the AA0.4 core? at what speeds?

[ansonl 20]

@ultiarjan Are you able to provide the files for your UM2+ direct drive conversion? I'm running a UM2+ extruder on a UMO+ and would like to try out your setup! Thanks. 

[lrodriguez 32]

On 1/7/2022 at 11:19 AM, ansonl said:

@ultiarjan Are you able to provide the files for your UM2+ direct drive conversion? I'm running a UM2+ extruder on a UMO+ and would like to try out your setup! Thanks. 

@ansonl it is listed above at the bottom of this post. The link is S5_FlexDirect.zip
 

 

[BalsaMichel 12]

Thank´s for sharing this!!

 

I have done it now with my Ulti 2+, Bondtech extruder and the original feeder stepper. I have reduced jerk to 10mm, acceleration to 500mm/sec2 and also maximum speed to 150mm/sec. The "elephant printhead" runs much smoother than expected and my TPU printing issues seem to be gone.

 

It´s important to build this thing stiff enough because this combination has really a lot of power and would bend the vertikal plate when nozzle is clogged for example.

 

Although this was done for two 15-20 hour TPU print jobs, I don´t think I will convert this back to bowden extruder. Ulti 2+ are not expensive anymore on ebay an I would rather buy a second one for the standard jobs.

 

 

 

Micha

 

 

 

 

Edited July 1, 2023 by BalsaMichel
wrong pics :-))

[3DPrintPhil 0]

Hello all,

 

this is a really great conversion. I am running an UM 2+ with Klipper and wuld like to convert the machine to a direct drive setup without changing the existing components. Basically my setup is the same like this in the post above with the Bondtech extruder. 

Can someone help where I can find the files for the UM2+? The provided ZIP data is only valid for UM S5..

 

I appreciate your support.

 

Kind regards Philipp

[JamesHarmer 0]

Awesome I am looking to do this (run um2+ with klipper).

I am struggling to find a config to use as a base for my setup. I am having issues with my um2 board randomly doing stuff mid print so I think something on my board is knackered, and want to try moving all the processing off on to a raspberry pi to see if it makes a difference. If it is broken I think will just update with a bigtreetech board. I recently upgraded my cr-10 with one and it is a beast now. 

 

Could you possibly share your um2+ printer config with us please? That would be a great start for me.