Ender 3 Pro - Bed Adhesion Issue with Cura

[Fireowl87 0]

Hello All,

 

I am extremely sorry for taking so long to get back to everyone. I thought the issue was the Cura GCODE for the longest time, but after printer time after time I found it had nothing to due with the GCODE. Instead it was 1) Bed Leveling and 2) Bed Adhesion. 

 

For the longest time I tried leveling the bed by putting the nozzle in all four corners of the bed and turning the knobs under the bed to adjust the bed within one sheet of paper from the nozzle. Often it worked the first time, but I could never get good consistence bed adhesion. So eventually I gave in and bought Creality 3D Upgraded BLTouch 3.1 Version Auto Bed Leveling Sensor Kit. 

 

While upgrading to the BLTouch 3.1 I decided to also flash my firmware to Marlin. One VERY IMPORTANT thing to know the Creality 3D Upgraded BLTouch 3.1 Version Auto Bed Leveling Sensor Kit comes with a USB ISP. You CANNOT use a USB ISP to flash your 3D Printer (or if you can I could not figure it out with weeks of research). So do not be like me and think for weeks you bricked your printer trying to flash it with the USB ISP that came with the Auto Bed Leveling Sensor Kit. Instead save yourself and please please just buy a USBasp. Then I used TH3D_UFW_U1.R2.B5 to flash my ender because it seemed the simplest at the time. 

 

The BLTouch helped a lot especially in tuning, but you still have to use the knobs to get the bed as level as you can, then the BLTouch will do the rest. However with the magnetic stock Creality bed I still found bed adhesion was an issue. So I bought a glass bed which really helped in providing a very level and even surface. Then I use a glue stick to put a very light coat on top of the glass bed to help the PLA stick and since then I have had much better bed adhesion.

 

So that is my best advice BLTouch 3.1 kit (and buy USBasp) and Glass bed with glues stick. Then you can use whatever GCODE you want.  

 

Current GCODES:

 

Start:

 

Script based on an original created by tjjfvi (https://github.com/tjjfvi)

; An up-to-date version of the tjjfvi's original script can be found

; here: https://csi.t6.fyi/

; Note - This script will only work in Cura V4.2 and above!

; --- Global Settings

; layer_height = {layer_height}

; smooth_spiralized_contours = {smooth_spiralized_contours}

; magic_mesh_surface_mode = {magic_mesh_surface_mode}

; machine_extruder_count = {machine_extruder_count}

; --- Single Extruder Settings

; speed_z_hop = {speed_z_hop}

; retraction_amount = {retraction_amount}

; retraction_hop = {retraction_hop}

; retraction_hop_enabled = {retraction_hop_enabled}

; retraction_enable = {retraction_enable}

; retraction_speed = {retraction_speed}

; retraction_retract_speed = {retraction_retract_speed}

; retraction_prime_speed = {retraction_prime_speed}

; speed_travel = {speed_travel}

 

;Sliced at: {day} {date} {time}

;Basic settings: Layer height: {layer_height} Walls: {wall_thickness} Fill: {fill_density}

;Print time: {print_time}

;Filament used: {filament_amount}m {filament_weight}g

;Filament cost: {filament_cost}

;M190 S{print_bed_temperature} ;Uncomment to add your own bed temperature line

;M109 S{print_temperature} ;Uncomment to add your own temperature line

G21 ;metric values

G90 ;absolute positioning

M82 ;set extruder to absolute mode

M107 ;start with the fan off

G28 X0 Y0 ;move X/Y to min endstops

G28 Z0 ;move Z to min endstops

G29

G1 Z15.0 F{travel_speed} ;move the platform down 15mm

G92 E0 ;zero the extruded length

G1 F200 E3 ;extrude 3mm of feed stock

G92 E0 ;zero the extruded length again

G1 F{travel_speed}

;Put printing message on LCD screen

 

END:

;End GCode

M104 S0 ;extruder heater off

M140 S0 ;heated bed heater off (if you have it)

G91 ;relative positioning

G1 E-1 F300 ;retract the filament a bit before lifting the nozzle, to release some of the pressure

G1 Z+0.5 E-5 X-20 Y-20 F{travel_speed} ;move Z up a bit and retract filament even more

G28 X0 Y0 ;move X/Y to min endstops, so the head is out of the way

M84 ;steppers off

G90 ;absolute positioning

M81

;{profile_string}

 

Old GCODES (before BLTouch):

Start

; Ender 3 Custom Start G-code

G92 E0 ; Reset Extruder

G28 ; Home all axes

G1 Z2.0 F3000 ; Move Z Axis up little to prevent scratching of Heat Bed

G1 X0.1 Y20 Z0.3 F5000.0 ; Move to start position

G1 X0.1 Y200.0 Z0.3 F1500.0 E15 ; Draw the first line

G1 X0.4 Y200.0 Z0.3 F5000.0 ; Move to side a little

G1 X0.4 Y20 Z0.3 F1500.0 E30 ; Draw the second line

G92 E0 ; Reset Extruder

G1 Z2.0 F3000 ; Move Z Axis up little to prevent scratching of Heat Bed

G1 X5 Y20 Z0.3 F5000.0 ; Move over to prevent blob squish

 

End

G91 ;Relative positioning

G1 E-2 F2700 ;Retract a bit

G1 E-2 Z0.2 F2400 ;Retract and raise Z

G1 X5 Y5 F3000 ;Wipe out

G1 Z10 ;Raise Z more

G90 ;Absolute positionning

 

G1 X0 Y{machine_depth} ;Present print

M106 S0 ;Turn-off fan

M104 S0 ;Turn-off hotend

M140 S0 ;Turn-off bed

 

M84 X Y E ;Disable all steppers but Z

 

 

 

[GregValiant 1,251]

When you customize a machine you make it yours, and what little support there was goes away.  Good job chasing this down.

 

I like the "Present Print" code that slides the table all the way forward after a print.  It's a personal preference, but I would copy that "Old" End Gcode back into Cura.  The BLT code is done once the initial G29 is finished doing it's thing.

 

Being the nasty person I am I'll take a moment to remind you of a line from your opening post:

"Now before you say bed leveling, temperature heating or bed adhesive. ..."

Edited December 21, 2020 by GregValiant

[jmart7 0]

Hello and I'm new (1 week) to the ender 3 pro as well.  

I am receiving the exact non-stick issues as Fireowl87 and amalinahmad.

Also, I am using the Ultimaker Cura for slicing and have implemented the changes suggested by Greg Valiant, but unfortunately, I am still having the issue. The PLA filament that I am using is eSun PLA+ 1.75.

Changes made so far are:

1. Initial Layer Height is .15

2. Printing temperature 210

3. Bed Plate temperature 60

 

Any additional suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

John

[GregValiant 1,251]

There are a lot of flow settings in Cura.  One of them is Initial Layer Flow.  Set it at 110%.  You didn't mention your print speed but make the Initial Layer Speed 35.

Make no mistake, that is a crutch and not a fix, but slow and heavy can make up for problems until you get the routine down.  @gr5 has a good video on bed leveling / adhesion that he will share when he gets out of bed.  It will teach you the right way so you can throw away the crutches.

Edited December 30, 2020 by GregValiant

[jmart7 0]

Thank you for the quick response Greg.

I'm still having the same issues. Per your advice, I will wait on the video on bed leveling/adhesion.

Changes made so far are:

1. Initial Layer Height - .15

2. Printing temperature - 210

3. Build Plate temperature - 60

4. Initial Layer Flow - 110%

5. Initial Layer Speed - 35

6. Print Speed - 50

 

Thanks

 

[Rockgecko17a 0]

I just got an ender 3 pro about 5 days ago. Printing my 6th print at the moment. I had a ton of bed adhesion problems too. The thing that fixed it for me was realizing that the bed was just a bit lower in the center and bringing the bed closer to the nozzle and checking it there. Using printer paper is too thick for my build plate I think. I also tightened the wheels on the hot end carriage at the same time since I noticed it. I suspect that helped me level the bed more accurately. Now the first plastic is squished into the build plate and makes a nice smooth layer to start.

[Mari 36]

If you use the magnetic flex mat, put a piece of alu foil in the middle of the bed under the flex mat... to compensate the "dip" in de heated bed!

 

Levelling the bed can be a pain-in-the-*ss, but you have to learn how to do it right!

 

There is a Ender 3/Ender 3 Pro group on Facebook, it seems that the whole world bought a 3D-printer for the holidays and now the all have the same problem: nothing sticks to the bed... 🤕

[GregValiant 1,251]

If you use cooking type "parchment paper" or a thin store receipt you can get a better feel for leveling.

Here is gr5's THE_VIDEO.

Edited December 30, 2020 by GregValiant

[Rockgecko17a 0]

Foil under the magnetic build mat sounds like an interesting idea! Thanks. I am certainly learning about bed leveling and close tolerances when doing it. My calipers tell me that my piece of paper is about .15 thick. When I have it a bit snug with the nozzle around the edges then I have no contact at all in the center. Seems like it must be a small amount maybe .05mm? And yet it makes all the difference between a nice firm base layer and the nozzle just pushing the extrusion all around the bed. I guess I  end up with something like .1mm at the edges and .15mm at the center when I am done. I should try the parchment or something thinner.

[jmart7 0]

Greg, thank you for the video. It helped to look at leveling and adhesion. 

Correct leveling helped resolve my issues, because originally I was only leveling at the corners, instead of where I was actually printing.

I appreciate it.

 

John

[GregValiant 1,251]

It was gr5 who was Mr. Hands there.

 

One thing you will definitely learn about 3d printing is that there is more to learn about 3d printing.

[Rockgecko17a 0]

Given the tolerances are in the tenths of millimeters. I am disappointed that the bed is so clearly not flat to tighter tolerances. I printed a small drawer and the wide flat bottom showed clearly that in once area in particular there was a high spot that protruded completely through the first layer.  At least that was how it looked. Is a glass bed supposed to be a solution for a truly flat bed?

[nitro20 1]

Ok.....here we go..ive had this ender v2 for a month...it has worked great..wasted about 20lbs of pla just to learn fusion...lolol....20lbs of pla is the key sentence, all of a sudden my adhesion layer peals up on the back stroke on the back side only..not the stroke moveing in the fan duck drection..i have OCD so i have done EVERYTHING on the intnerwebs....

I see a few fixes here ill try, BUT the question i am wondering is WHY IS THERE 1000S OF PEOPLE WITH THIS SAME COMPLAINT? "Ender was working fine then all of a sudden the first layer stop sticking"...... mabye we should takle that problem, instead of a work around....just seems funny that ALL OF A SUDDEN, it stops......????????????? 

 

 

[GregValiant 1,251]

You wash it nice.  Wipe it off with isopropyl alcohol.  Put a dusting of AquaNet Super Hold on it.  Level the bed with a piece of parchment paper or a store receipt.  Print.

Did you watch the video?  It's kinda long but explains the process.  I look at it like this...what goes on in the little combustion chamber of a gas engine is really complicated even though it's in a tiny space.  The space under the nozzle is even tinier but it's even more complicated.  All sorts of science and techno crap, formulas, calculus, thermodynamics, probably even astronomy and voodoo.  It boils down to getting a first layer that sticks to the bed.  Some folks never figure it out.  Then they buy a BLtouch and can't figure out how to install it much less get it to work.

Watch the video.  There are things you can do to promote adhesion.  You can kick up the Initial Layer Flow to 110%.  You can practice leveling till ya wanna puke, 

 

Look at it...such a cute little machine.  It pushes out hot plastic and makes stuff.  What could be simpler right?

[Mari 36]

Take a look in the Ender 3/Ender 3 Pro Facebook Group... it is a soap... people who own their first 3D-printer are giving others advice about bad bed adhesion... buy glass bed, level bed, level the bed again, buy BLTouch, etc. etc.  But they forget that whatever bed you use and even when your bed is 1000% level and the nozzle is at the perfect height, the role of material can play a role in good of bad bed adhesion...

 

I had bad bed adhesion 2 days ago, so I did level the bed again like I did before, cleaned the bed, but still no luck in getting a good first layer... Put the role of PLA in my filament dryer... +44% humidity... after a few hours of drying that dropped to 15%... Have put the role back on the machine and had good first layers again... 

 

 

Edited January 9, 2021 by Mari

[nitro20 1]

Thank you SO much, we have someone who can think out side the box and thinks maybe, everyones NOT A DUMBASS.

 U know when 1000s of people say the same thing but hear 10,000 people telling them what they was told and most likely stopped working..

Leveling bed, bla bla.....what about shitty tips, unsqaure extruder to bed..... NOT unlevel bed..

u can level ur bed ALL FKIN DAY and if you push out more one way then the other, ur screwed before u press print. especially when useing .03 .02 tips...

i might be new to 3d printing..but i have OCD and theres nothing worst then when something JUST STOP WORKIN FOR NO REASON WITHIN ONE PRINT TO THE NEXT..no joke, 20 lbs of pla and bam, NO MOS PRINTORA..LOLOL...

[nitro20 1]

h km

 ya, i bought ALL the hop ups only to be needing the double drive filiment gear thing.., went back to the white tube, only keeping the blue tube inside the hot end...

 

Bltouch, lol, i got one, u want it.. it could fry ur board or it may work..u find out....i dont feel like working on another problem for creality... lololol we are the gini pigs..lol...

[Mari 36]

No need for BLTouch... I have this printer almost 2 years, in those 2 years I had to level the bed maybe 4 or 5 times (even when it was not needed)...

[GregValiant 1,251]

Mine needs leveling more than that.  It takes maybe a minute with my app and the touchscreen laptop.  Any leveling "print" will work so long as the X and Y numbers put the head where you want it.  When comparing the time involved in leveling, to a 3 hour print, it's a non-issue.

Over on Reddit there are an amazing number of posts by people who SHOULD have left the BLTouch in the box (along with the SKR mini V99 they got talked into installing).  Now they have a mess.  It always makes wonder..."Hey, did you get into 3d printing to print(?) or as an electronics repair hobby?".  Because a lot of them don't have any idea what they're doing and they are often the ones giving advice to others.  Other than the Cura page (and two other contributors who are real good), there is a lot of mis-information flying around over there that is being spoken as gospel truth.

 

Anyway, that's my "I really need another cup of coffee" early morning rant.  Sorry.

Edited January 10, 2021 by GregValiant

[5ynt4x3rr0r 0]

I've found that the reason that Cura doesn't adhere well is because Cura likes to move the Z axis up before printing to minimize scratching and not be directly on the print bed. The issue is, we already do that when we do bed leveling.

 

see the 'G1 Z2.0 F300'?

 

A quick and dirty trick would be to just delete the part that says 'G1 Z2.0 F3000' from the 'start G-Code' in Cura.

[IRobertI 520]

6 minutes ago, 5ynt4x3rr0r said:

I've found that the reason that Cura doesn't adhere well is because Cura likes to move the Z axis up before printing to minimize scratching and not be directly on the print bed. The issue is, we already do that when we do bed leveling.

 

see the 'G1 Z2.0 F300'?

 

A quick and dirty trick would be to just delete the part that says 'G1 Z2.0 F3000' from the 'start G-Code' in Cura.

Look at the line under that, it moves back to Z0.3 to begin printing.

[5ynt4x3rr0r 0]

I know but that is also something that needs to not happen. I already do bed leveling and moving up the Z-axis isn't needed

[GregValiant 1,251]

You can do a Search and Replace to get rid of that line.

I found that using Search and Replace and changing "G1 F1500 E-6.5" to "G92 E-6.5" works for me.  It provides extra prime at the start of a skirt (or whatever).  The down side is that if I change my retraction distance, I have to remember to change the plugin Search criteria.

If Z-hops are enabled I don't believe the line "G1 Z2.0 F300" shows up.  Instead it's "G1 Z(initialLayerHeight+ZHop)" so in many of my prints it becomes Z0.7 as opposed to Z2.0.

At any rate, extrusion doesn't start at the elevated height, but rather at the working height of the first layer.  I have never found any problems with bed adhesion that can be blamed on Cura.  For me, it's always been "Userware".

 

[5ynt4x3rr0r 0]

After a long time testing, I have found that my issue was  the bed adhesion setting. I changed it from 'Skirt' to 'Raft' and it worked like a charm. I also used the G-Code from the fourth reply in this thread

Edited February 3, 2021 by 5ynt4x3rr0r

[cheesegrits 0]

I had exactly the same issue with my Ender 3 Pro.  Printing from the out-of-box Creality Slicer I had no adhesion issues.  With Cura, using the default profiles, as soon as the first layer had any curves in it, it would pull the filament off the bed.

After reading this thread and applying the collective wisdom, I seem to have fixed it by a combination of:

 

Using parchment paper instead of printer paper for bed levelling.
Reducing first layer speed to 15.

Increasing first layer flow rate to 110%.
Increasing first layer height from .12 to .16 (in the Super Quality profile).

The only significant difference I could see between the Creality and Cura settings was the first layer height, which was 0.3 in Creality and .12 in Cura.  So maybe the bump from .12 to .16 was the key, idk.  First layer speed was 20 on both, but I dropped it to 15 anyway.

I probably should have tried these changes one by one, but I was so frustrated I threw them all on at once.  I'll probably revisit this soon when I have to recalibrate everything for the SKR Mini e3 v2 arriving next week (the printer shares office space with my wife, who would very much appreciate quieter operation) and update my post if I find a single magic bullet.

Thank you to everyone who contributed suggestions on this thread.

 

   -- hugh