Upgrading extruders and printcores to print more abrasive material on Ult 3E

[Jls667 0]

Is there a benefit to printing more abrasive materials than the standard materials?

 

What extruders do people like? I see lots of discussions on Bondtech. I am a bit concerned that printing will be more complicated with the necessary speed changes in my printer.

 

Is there any benefit to using a CC ruby printcore?

[Smithy 1,144]

I depends on your needs, if you really need parts filled with glass fibre or carbon. Such materials can be really good for specific needs, but for "normal" usage I would say it is not worth the effort. Keep also in mind that printing with such materials is more complicated than with other ones. (bed adhesion, layer bonding, warping) 

 

You have to buy two extruders, because you have to adjust the steps for the new extruder and the UM3 has only one step value, valid for both extruders. Then you need the CC core, which if officially not supported on the UM3 or you buy the 3DSolex hard core with a ruby nozzle. So the investment is big. Printing with the normal AA core will wear out the nozzle very quickly.

 

So its up to you, but I would not do it.

 

[JohnInOttawa 104]

In my case, I upgraded my UM3 to bondtech DDG (set of 2 for UM3)and used Hardcore print cores with everlast nozzles of a few sizes.

 

I have been pretty happy with the change.  Nothing is ever perfect and there is a firmware change to manage (bondtech provides a software tool now), but I find the bondtech feeders slip less and I have been able to print things more easily than with the original setup, with less worry.  One aspect of the hardcore is that changing nozzles must be done with care to avoid fracturing the heat break.

 

A used Ultimaker 3X just joined the operation and it came with another hardcore, this one in need of overhaul.  Based on the experience with the bondtech feeders to date, I have purchased a set for the UM3X too and hope to refurbish the hardcore shortly.

 

Whether this is a good idea for anyone else will depend heavily on intended use.  On another thread I posted using breakaway support as rafting material so I could print flat nylon/CF with the same suface texture top and bottom and without warping.  That has gone very well users really like the parts and the combination of dual extrusion with abrasives is actually helping my business.

 

The old UM3 feeders have not been run on abrasives and will be repurposed as an upgrade to a UM2Go.  Probably can't use one on my UMO but exploring that possibility.

 

I hope this helps!  All the best

John

[Jls667 0]

That really helps. Thank you. I just wanted some opinions. I have experienced some extruder/feeder slipping, so Bondtech might be a good choice.

[marine3D 6]

Personally I'm a fan of the Bondtech QRs - Already have one UM3 converted and looking at doing another one soon, always found the position of the extruders lower down a bit of a pain and filament insertion is a breeze on the QRs.

 

Does anyone know what actually happens with the CC core on a UM3 - Does Cura still recognise the core and accept it on a UM3 (Maybe with a yellow warning box or similar)? Does the printer still accept it but with an override confirmation button?

 

Thanks

[Smithy 1,144]

In the past it was exactly like that, so the core was accepted, Cura shows the yellow warning sign, but it was possible to use it. I don't think that has changed, so it should still work. I can test it later, but have currently no printer available because I rearrange everything in my workshop and have currently only chaos 🙂 

[Jls667 0]

It looks like Bondtech has two models of extruders for the Ultimakers. What are the differences between the QR and the DDG ones? I assume QR stands for quick release.

 

[marine3D 6]

@Jls667 - The exact technical difference I'm not 100% on but the DDG is just the drive gears/housing but still uses the existing UM motor, whilst the QR also includes the motor and you need to run the cabling down the back on the unit. I believe both are still duel drive and hardened...

 

I think the DDG works out cheaper and less of a 'change' compared to the QR, but I'm still happy with the QRs.

 

@Smithy - Thank you for the feedback. Fingers crossed for some Black Friday deals to jump in on for the CC cores!

[Jls667 0]

I am also tempted to get a CC core. Maybe a Black Friday deal would get me to buy one.

[JohnInOttawa 104]

Just to add to marine3D, I looked at both options, twice, as the two UM3's arrived at different times. 

 

I still went with the DDG for the second upgrade for the reason marine3d mentioned.  Despite having the UM3X stripped down for cleaning, all covers off and clear access for cabling, I considered the complexity and cost, as well as the incremental improvement I already had going from stock to DDG, and decided it was enough for me to stick with the DDG's  That also offered me some interchangeability between systems, FWIW.  Should be transparent, but I am trying to keep common things common where I can.

J

[Jls667 0]

I assume changing the settings in the UM3 for the new extruders is straightforward. Will I have to change those setting every time there is a new software upgrade in my UM3?

[marine3D 6]

As long as you are happy using ssh via terminal/putty then yes, and the instructions are fairly clear. Alternatively if you have a windows pc, Bondtech have released a handy installer that will do the changes for you.

 

And yes this needs to be done everytime there is a firmware update, tho those are few and far between now with the older UM3. However, I was surprised we had one recently to bring it up to date with the digital factory and I read somewhere there might be one more early next year, which is encouraging cough cough intent profiles!!!

 

 

[marine3D 6]

CC core received.

 

The UM3 accepts it but warns it's not compatible with selected material (PLA), which seems strange but you just continue as normal.

 

Cura on the otherhand, whilst it can see the CC 0.6 on the printer, doesn't allow you to select it (And playing around with a S3, the CC core is missing from the dropdown list when using custom settings). To fix this:

 

1. Rename/copy/backup the file ultimaker_s3_cc06.inst.cfg found in:

 

/Applications/Ultimaker Cura.app/Contents/Resources/resources/variants (This is on a Mac)

 

to ultimaker3_cc06.inst.cfg and change the definition from = ultimaker_s3 to = ultimaker3, restart Cura and it shows up now, just with the standard yellow warning.

 

To fix the yellow warning, both the below need to be amended.

 

2. Amending material profile found in:

 

/Applications/Ultimaker Cura.app/Contents/Resources/resources/materials

 

Adjust generic_pla.xml.fdm_material to include the CC 0.6 as compatible with the following added under the UM3 heading:

 

<hotend id="CC 0.6">
                <setting key="hardware compatible">yes</setting>
                <setting key="standby temperature">100</setting>
                <setting key="retraction amount">6.5</setting>
            </hotend>

 

This needs to be done per material which will be a pain but if you print with a limited amount of materials, might be worth spending the 5-10 mins updating the files.

 

3. Importing profiles. Copy files:

 

um_s3_cc0.6_PLA_Draft_Print.inst.cfg

um_s3_cc0.6_PLA_Fast_Print.inst.cfg

 

Found in

/Applications/Ultimaker Cura.app/Contents/Resources/resources/quality/ultimaker_s3

 

to 

/Applications/Ultimaker Cura.app/Contents/Resources/resources/quality/ultimaker3

 

Rename to:

um3_cc0.6_PLA_Draft_Print.inst.cfg

um3_cc0.6_PLA_Fast_Print.inst.cfg

And change definitions to match in each file.

 

Now I'm sure some of the settings in the above files are S3 specific so amend at your own risk, and obviously when updating Cura need to have the files saved somewhere else otherwise they'll get deleted but first test print is underway with no issues.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 14, 2020 by marine3D

[Jls667 0]

Thank you. If I ever get the CC Printcore, this will be very useful.

[RedRover72 0]

@marine3d

Thank you for this!! I am upgrading my UM3X to the Bondtech DDG v2 and 3dSolex Printcores. Although they don't need to emulate CC cores, I was looking for a way to get a 0.6mm profile added, and this does the trick.