Hmmm well I don't need ssh per se but I was hoping to be able to e.g get some data on the print status, send gcode directly and possibly via a nodejs server. If that's not feasible then OctoPrint becomes a lot more tempting but then the "Connect" aspect seems rather limited.
Is there then a DigitalFactory or any API to programmatically send and execute some gcode??
Edited by utopiahUnfortunately that's not possible with the UM2+C, you can only send print jobs, gcode via the DF but not directly. The printer has not the same functionality as the UM3 or the S-Line, where it is possible to send print jobs directly from Cura to the printer or via API calls. So you can only send files via the Digitalfactory cloud but not directly. Without the DF you can only save the files to the USB stick and put it into the printer.
It is also not possible to use Octoprint with the UM2+C (also not with UM3, S3, S5) because the USB port is just for the USB stick, but not for direct printing, which is a functionality Octoprint needs.
UM works hardly on their cloud (Digitalfactory) so maybe there will be the possibility to use some API calls for 3rd party scripts or apps in the future. But as far as I know it is currently not possible.
If you really want to such things, then I would say you have bought the wrong printer. On the other hand the printer has really great print quality and just think about if you really need all these things you have currently as ideas in your head. I am in the opposite situation, I have an UM2+ Extended and an UM2Go too, both with Raspberry, Octoprint and Webcam. It works, but I prefer the way of the UM2+C, it is much easier and I get the same result. Personally I have no need anymore to get "more" out of the printer with some scripts or gadgets. But I know what you mean, I am also the tinkerer and if I have some ideas I want to do it, but in the end it was just for fun and had mostly no real benefit.
The printer is new and as far as I understood you are also new to 3D printing. So my advice, concentrate in 3D printing, there are so much possibilities what you can do and believe me, you don't need more functionality the UM2+C has currently.
Pragmatically speaking you are probably right. The UM2+C probably covers or should cover with firmware updates all I might need. Yet, I specifically bought an Ultimaker rather than e.g. a Flashforge because of the company commitment to open source. Now if I the 1st thing I want to do, beside printing directly in the workflow managed by the manufacturer, is not supported, that's perfectly fine. The problem is if that is impossible to change without e.g. reverse engineering the device and some proprietary protocol. If my crazy ideas make no sense or would take me years to implement, that's on me. If the ecosystem though does not afford tinkering then, not only did I not buy the right printer but worst than that I didn't buy into the right ecosystem. If that's the case then I'll see if there i a way to backtrack my purchase. It would be a shame as indeed the result, in terms of print quality and even on-boarding, is quite impressive. That being said if my freedom to tinker is limited because the business model starts to focus efforts and create artificial limitations for an audience that wants to click&print then I made the wrong choice.
Edited by utopiahFor full open source and many possibilities to tinker around, the UM2+ (without Connect) would be the printer you are looking for. Firmware Source and parts are published on GitHub, so you can change everything you want.
Thanks then I'll have to dig deeper. If the newer model can do less than the previous one it appears like a regression, hence my confusion. Assuming it's a strategical decision I'd be interested in knowing the logic behind it.
Naive question then, can I at least using Cura/CuraEngine connect over the network directly (Ethernet or WiFi, no console cable) to send G-code or am I stuck with Digital Factory? What if it is inaccessible for any reason (e.g my Internet connection is down), would I be stuck having to use a USB stick despite the printer being on the same network?
7 hours ago, utopiah said:If the newer model can do less than the previous one it appears like a regression, hence my confusion. Assuming it's a strategical decision I'd be interested in knowing the logic behind it.
The new UM2+C has more features and can do more than the previous one. For example the UM2+ has no network connection at all, the UM2+C has newer stepper drivers, new electronics and a touch display. The decision I guess is clear, it fits perfectly in the eco system of UM with the digital factory, which covers now nearly all printers. The DF is a big benefit when you have more printers, because you have all informations in one place. The target group for Ultimaker printers are business customers and they want a uniform stable system and not an Octoprint tinkering solution.
7 hours ago, utopiah said:Naive question then, can I at least using Cura/CuraEngine connect over the network directly (Ethernet or WiFi, no console cable) to send G-code or am I stuck with Digital Factory? What if it is inaccessible for any reason (e.g my Internet connection is down), would I be stuck having to use a USB stick despite the printer being on the same network?
This is actually a disadvantage of the UM2+C, which is also unique to this printer. You can only send your files to the printer via the DF, there is no local direct connection. If your internet is down, you can only use the USB stick.
Yes the new model has more and is overall better. I'm not questioning that and to be honest I don't even have the expertise to challenge that. What I'm saying though is that if an older model has a feature, e.g. connecting to ssh and being able to execute some Gcode, but the newer model does not but theoretically could (in fact it does in some way otherwise DF wouldn't be able to send those commands, albeit by another protocol than ssh) it is a software regression. What was possible before is not anymore.
Now if the target group changed from tinkerers and makers to "business customers" and that you are convinced according to your discussions with them that would prefer not to have the option to not rely on the cloud, that's a perfectly fine decision.
It does show though that I personally misunderstood what Ultimaker was as a company. I thought it did provide some of the best in terms of quality, "a uniform stable system" (which again I truly appreciate, DF worked like a charm) but also a way for tinkerers to build something new on their own. I didn't go in depth through the specs of the UM2+C and assume the DF cloud hosted on Google (according to some Github repositories) was optional.
Now the few ideas I had in mind :
seem to have the same degree of complexity that if I did buy in a closed system that I'd then have to reverse engineer. Are there then any solution here to :
Any practical solution or clarification on what future related features planned would be greatly appreciated.
PS: being a prototypist I'm all too aware that being a "professional tinkerer" (literally how I pay my bills) might not be a target group but I still have to find ways to go beyond what the initial creators of any product have intended. Always an uncomfortable position but hopefully also always interesting!
Edited by utopiahFirst of all I don't work for UM, I am just a fan and own a lot of UM printers, so I cannot give official answers.
All of the things you want to achieve, is not possible with some simple steps. But nobody can or will stop you from "hacking" into the system. The printer is quite new, so you will not find any useful information and how tos on the internet. But when you try to get access to the printer, you can install everything there if you have enough space on the board.
DF is closed source and there is no way to install it locally, it is a cloud solution like gmail.
But again my opinion is that if you want to have a fantastic printer you have already what you want. If you want to have just the hardware and want to build your own software around it or modify it hardly with new features, it is the wrong printer for you.
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2 hours ago, Smithy said:First of all I don't work for UM, I am just a fan and own a lot of UM printers, so I cannot give official answers.
Thank you but even if it's not official your answers do help me get a better understanding of the situation. I don't want to sound negative so I'm truly grateful for your clarifications, even though they are not going in the direction I hoped for. I still "argue" here as others, in an official manner or not, might jump in and also because it helps me to clarify what I actually need and, possibly, how.
Regarding DF replacement, yes I understand it's a cloud solution but I also noticed https://github.com/Ultimaker/cloudrun-action and a reference to startdust-web so I imagine there could be some code for that also. In fact I have another device, the reMarkable 1 and 2 (writable e-ink devices) running on Linux where the exact same situation happened. Namely that the devices by default connect to the manufacturer cloud instance hosted on Google Cloud. Because, for moral and privacy-focused reason I try whenever possible to avoid Google based products, I relied instead on a community created alternative (named https://github.com/ddvk/rmfakecloud) and my own scripts to have a local solution. Consequently I'm wondering how a similar result could be achieved.
Maybe an alternative path would be to
In the end I don't care for ssh per se (even though I do like to be able to look at the "guts" of my hardware, live) but I'm still look for a programmatic way to control the printer.
6 hours ago, utopiah said:but I also noticed https://github.com/Ultimaker/cloudrun-action and a reference to startdust-web so I imagine there could be some code for that also
Yes it is possible, the DF is under active development and I guess there will come more. Maybe also an official image to install a private DF for companies which don't like to go to the cloud - but I don't know.
6 hours ago, utopiah said:develop a community plugin for the marketplace. I imagine this gives me a way to program Cura which itself send command to DF then to the printer?
Cura plugins are python scripts and you can do a lot with them. So maybe you can use this way, give it a try.
Would like to say that if any Ultimaker staff are reading this thread. I would love to be able to SSH into my UM2+C. The main reason for me is I would love to integrate it into Home Assistant. It would be as easy as adding a developer mode option in the settings, that way the port will stay closed for those who do not want SSH open.
I have no idea why there is no developer mode, but I am sure there is a reason and not just to close the system. The S-Line printers have still all the developer mode. Maybe there was an issue and it will come later with an update.
But out of curiosity what would you do with Home Assistant and the printer? I am personally interested because I do a lot with NodeRed in my home.
I’m using WebThings.io for my IoT gateway and would also like to integrate it, even if just to know the current printing status and thus being able to integrate with my other Things with rules. Unfortunately I gave up since last Winter due to the lack of UM update on the topic. Quite disappointed for this price point.
Well I have modded mine to have a camera so I can monitor the print remotely (Cant attach photos if anyone is interested, running off of an OrangePi), so I have would like to have a tab setup to show the camera, status of the print, etc... Also would like to set it up so when its done printing it can send me a notification via HA and flash the lights in my office to let me know its done.
Once I have done that much done, I will probably have more ideas flowing on things I can do
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That’s indeed what I’d do but the “Connect” in the brand name led me to think integration would be flawless, at least for such basic use case. Sure we can find independent systems to monitor but that is far from ideal. Thanks still for sharing an example.
As already said, I don't know why there is no developer mode with SSH connection, but SSH was enabled in the very first pre-release firmware, so I guess it is just deactivated.
Just an idea if someone wants to tinker and try it on their own risk. The built in Onion board has a serial connector and they offer an "expansion dock" with a USB to serial. So if you buy such an expansion board you should be able to connect to the console of the Onion. Then you could just do what you want or enable the SSH daemon.
Not sure if it really works, but I read the docs of the Onion board some months ago and thought oh, this could be a possibility to get OS access again, but I never tried it.
Keep also in mind that the Onion board has very limited resources, not comparable with a Pi. So I don't think there are enough resources to install additional packages, like the mjpeg streamer or something else.
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In my experience: if the 3D Printer is a tool for you (just like a hammer etcetera) and you want to focus on modelling and just need the same consistent results, the Ultimaker 2+ Connect is perfect and should be marketed as such!
If you are a hacker and like to tinker alot with 3D printers and you just like to tweak every aspect of it: don't buy an Ultimaker, they are not geared towards the hacker market.
Friends of mine have Prusa's, Dremel, Anycubic and more of these and to be honest: NONE of them come even close to the consistency the Ultimaker 2+ Connect delivers WITHOUT any tinkering.
It's always fooling around with steppers, changing hardware for better consistency etcetera. Some of em print very well the first few prints and then all of a sudden aligment issues etcetera.
I don't like that, for me a printer is a tool, so ... anyone reading this: make your decision based on what you need and don't bash a system because YOU made the wrong decision 😉
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@kupfeli I'm genuinely confused here. Are you suggesting ssh should instead be disabled on other models?
PS: I would consider unearthing a 5 months old topic bad etiquette if it's not actually helpful.
Edited by utopiah5 minutes ago, utopiah said:@kupfeli I'm genuinely confused here. Are you suggesting ssh should instead be disabled on other models?
PS: I would consider unearthing a 5 months old topic bad etiquette if it's not actually helpful.
Oh I am terribly sorry! I did not take a look at the dates! I am also quite new on this Forum, just wanted to share some opinions, but did not want to unearth an old topic.
No worries it happens. Take care @kupfeli and welcome to the forum.
PS: yes it's great hardware leading to top quality prints.
Edited by utopiah
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Smithy 1,144
There is no developer mode on the UM2C, the SSH daemon is not running.
On the other hand there is not much for tinkering on this printer. The SSH daemon was running in an early beta version so I was able to take a look into the system, but there is mainly just the display gui thing and the daemon which connects to the digital factory. Also the Onion board itself has not much space and memory to run too much things, maybe that's the reason the SSH daemon was stopped by UM to save some space for other things.
In theory you could try to connect a console cable directly to the Onion board, but in my opinion it is not worth the effort and not worth to loose the warranty on a new printer.
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