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IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?


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Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?
2 hours ago, adi_s said:

geert_2

Thanks, Are you printing the supports with the same settings as the part?

In this way, when modeling a high tree support it use a lot more material and it is harder to remove the supports.

 

Yes. These models were designed a couple of years ago for single-nozzle printers, and older slicers. So they are all printed with the exact same settings. Sometimes I provide gaps to make removal easier, so that parts are only kept in place by strings, not modeled connections.

 

I consider these supports an integral part of the design, not a separate add-on later. Similar to when designing for injection moulding, then you also consider the fabrication method and aspects from the very beginning.

 

These are all very small models, so reachability and removability of the supports, without doing damage to the model, is most important. I must be able to grab the supports, and wiggle or pull them out.

 

For larger models, you could construct your own supports so that they consume very little material but are still quite strong. They don't have to be tree-shaped; you could also chose hollow cylinders or bars, or whatever shape suits the purpose.

 

For stability, be sure to give it a huge custom brim, so it bonds wel to the bed and won't be knocked over. Make the side walls strong enough, so they don't wobble. This is why a hollow cylinder or pipe-system could be better than a thin tree in some cases. (Your concept-drawings might suffer from these: not enough brim to prevent falling over, and the stems may be too thin to be stable.)

 

Include all required holes, slits and other features to get in there with a knife, scalpel, pliers, hooks, etc..., to remove the supports later on. Sometimes this requires a lot of thinking.

 

For dual nozzle printers, you could design a stiff and cheap support in PLA (if het main model is in PLA too), and only use a thin dissolvable PVA-interface layer between support tree and model, like this concept drawing, with a dove-tail for good bonding of PVA-support to PLA-support:

 

support_sandwich.thumb.jpg.e42b127a279f4a760c444239c73a086c.jpg

 

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Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?
24 minutes ago, geert_2 said:

 

Yes. These models were designed a couple of years ago for single-nozzle printers, and older slicers. So they are all printed with the exact same settings. Sometimes I provide gaps to make removal easier, so that parts are only kept in place by strings, not modeled connections.

.....

 

Thanks for the detailed answer!

I've just bought the printer 2 months ago and I'm studying the methods, materials and software. According to my trials the automatic supports in Cura are probably not good enough for me so I'm testing other support methods. I don't plan to print the model in this post, did it just to clarify the problem I encountered with Cura.

Will probably do as you suggested, model the supports in 3D modeling sw and not count on the slicers.

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    Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?

    support spacing is controlled in CAD and/or meshmixer.  not cura.  If cura generates it's own support with it's own algorithms - then yes you turn on the support features and you can set things like support gaps in x,y,z.

     

    But the feature you were using was intended to *remove* support from areas other than the shape.  You can add shapes to cura that can either block support.  Or exclude support outside the volume.  but since you are designing support in other software you need to disable all cura support features including the "per object" support features.

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    Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?
    3 hours ago, gr5 said:

    support spacing is controlled in CAD and/or meshmixer.  not cura.  If cura generates it's own support with it's own algorithms - then yes you turn on the support features and you can set things like support gaps in x,y,z.

     

    But the feature you were using was intended to *remove* support from areas other than the shape.  You can add shapes to cura that can either block support.  Or exclude support outside the volume.  but since you are designing support in other software you need to disable all cura support features including the "per object" support features.

     

    Thanks, As far as I tested Cura adds z space not just with it's own supports but also when creating a supports with the plugins "Custom supports" and "Cylindric Custom support" or importing a supports created elsewhere, it does so with any object with "mesh type: print as support". But all of these supports have the same problem, Cura adds unnecessary supports underneath it, even when supports is disabled.

    It seems as a bug in Cura.

     

    How to report the 2 bugs I encountered in Cura?

     

    I need a slicer that can handle custom tilted supports.

    I started today testing supports in Prusa slicer, hope it would be easier there.

     

     

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    Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?

    @adi_s - I disagree - I don't think you found any bugs yet.  Just maybe the language used in the gui is confusing.  Maybe you found a bug or two but if so then I don't understand.

     

    I think you are asking for a new feature: "create supports that support the model but fit within this mesh".  That feature doesn't exist yet in Cura.

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    Posted (edited) · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?

    The "bug" comes from your settings. With a normal configuration there is no problem to use these file as a Custom support.

    image.png.2d8dcd9fba997c97cb2d41b42795d5ee.png

     

    image.thumb.png.c036d9d87b0d5e3f2ebf1bf48df21d7b.png

    Edited by Cuq
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    Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?
    11 hours ago, Cuq said:

    The "bug" comes from your settings. With a normal configuration there is no problem to use these file as a Custom support.

    image.png.2d8dcd9fba997c97cb2d41b42795d5ee.png

     

    image.thumb.png.c036d9d87b0d5e3f2ebf1bf48df21d7b.png

    Thanks, What have you changed in my settings?
    Are you uings Cura 4.8?

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    Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?
    12 hours ago, gr5 said:

    @adi_s - I disagree - I don't think you found any bugs yet.  Just maybe the language used in the gui is confusing.  Maybe you found a bug or two but if so then I don't understand.

     

    I think you are asking for a new feature: "create supports that support the model but fit within this mesh".  That feature doesn't exist yet in Cura.

    If I save a 3mf file with this:

    https://content.invisioncic.com/ultimake/monthly_2021_01/3.jpg.f688fcf4c5295b90f9cd7d495e7bb017.jpg

     

    And when I reload it, is seems like this:

    https://content.invisioncic.com/ultimake/monthly_2021_01/5.jpg.f860eeb65ecd4ef3daec3420c4c0b02b.jpg

     

    Isn't this a bug?

     

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    Posted (edited) · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?
    15 hours ago, Cuq said:

    The "bug" comes from your settings. With a normal configuration there is no problem to use these file as a Custom support.

    image.png.2d8dcd9fba997c97cb2d41b42795d5ee.png

     

    image.thumb.png.c036d9d87b0d5e3f2ebf1bf48df21d7b.png

    Thanks!!
    When I read earlier your response I missed the "Support Placement: Everywhere". I changed it and it works. Wouldn't have guessed this parameter is relevant.

     

     

    16 hours ago, gr5 said:

    I think you are asking for a new feature: "create supports that support the model but fit within this mesh".  That feature doesn't exist yet in Cura.

    With the help of CuQ it seems there is such an option after all (-: Just not where I expected it to be.

     

     

    Edited by adi_s
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    Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?
    8 hours ago, adi_s said:

    Thanks, What have you changed in my settings?
    Are you uings Cura 4.8?

     yes 4.8 and just what you can see in the image -> Support placement : everywhere

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    Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?
    On 1/31/2021 at 3:04 AM, adi_s said:

    Isn't this a bug?

    Oh yes. That bug. Yes.

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    Posted · IS it possible to create a customized non vertical supports?
    On 1/27/2021 at 11:57 PM, geert_2 said:

    I often design custom supports in CAD, as part of the model, and then turn the slicer-support off, like gr5 said.

     

     

    Hi @geert_2   The technique you shared is very inspiring. Could you give some clues on how you make the support body stay where it is? Thank you!

    Image.png

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