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Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion


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Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

I am having this serious problem I cannot figure out. My nozzle is scratching my print every second layer and nothing extrudes during every second layer either, even if I raise the babystep z up so the nozzle is far from the print. This issue has forced me to buy simplify 3d. I am two days into my subscription. I can get a refund within the two week money back period. It is not my two printers because I do not have this problem with any other slicer. I have done everything I can think of. I even totally deleted and redownloaded cura several times, new and old versions. Remember, I said it is not extruding either even when I raise the z axis so there is plenty of room for extrusion. I do not have clogs because nothing extrudes. I am totally unable to use cura because of this and cura is my favorite. Please help.

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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    This sounds very strange.  Did you look at the Z positions in the gcode?  There should be only one Z move per layer.  I hope.  Look at the Z values and see if they make sense.  Also look at the E values to make sure the extruder keeps extruding.

     

    Also look at the Z speeds.  There was a bug where some printers didn't have a speed for the Z movement (or was it E movement?) and Cura defaulted to the speed of light.  Which the printer freaked out over.  Speeds are after the letter "F".  You can search for all the F values and make sure they are all under a million.

     

    Anyway, the point is, look at the gcodes and try to figure out exactly what is happening.  Narrow down the problem to something more specific.

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    Posted (edited) · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    I cannot figure this out. The gcode looked normal from what I could tell. I do not have this problem with simplify 3d or prusa but cura has tree supports and gyroid which I really enjoy! This sucks. I seem to be the only person with this exact problem. I am using two ender 5 pros.

    Edited by naziplanet
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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    Well I'm suspicious of Z axis from your description but I'd rather see a picture of your print.  Sometimes you can have a printer where the Z axis moves different amounts every other layer.

     

    Make sure your layer height is EXACTLY the same in the 2 slicers.  One might have 0.2mm layer height and the other 0.21mm layer height because maybe the 0.21 lines up better with the internal stepper resolution.

     

    Or maybe the Z movement speed is different between the 2 slicers.  Or Z acceleration might be set to a different value in one of the slicers (normally Z acceleration is not set in Cura but maybe it is in the other slicer).

     

    Or maybe you didn't slice the exact same STL and it's an issue with an overhang - like the bow of benchy - it's normal for the nozzle to hit the print (HARD!) on the bow of Benchy.

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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    Could you post that broken Gcode file and either a PrusaSlicer or Simplify3D file that does work?  Maybe there is something in there.  An error on every other layer is really odd.

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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    I think I may have bad extruder stepper motors because this is very recent and out of nowhere. That is what make sense to me. I have ordered replacements that will arrive friday. I think maybe cura reacts differently than simplify 3D and prusa to these bad motors. I will let you know if that fixes the issue. I will post gcode from cura and simplify 3d and pictures if this does not solve the problem. I appreciate both of your help. Hopefully I am right.

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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    Steppers are mostly indestructable and never fail.  Stepper drivers fail all the time.  Plus if a stepper driver overheats it just shuts off for a little while (anywhere from a fraction of a second to a few seconds).

     

    A clogged nozzle or simply printing too fast may look like a broken stepper as the stepper can miss a step and zip backwards.

     

    If you can video the problem happening that will help us with diagnosis.

     

    I hope the replacements fix the issue!

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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    CE5_Chip_Bag_Clip_V7_Small.gcodeI have attached a simple gcode that I took a video of. I also linked to the URL of that video I put on youtube just for your help, thank you! As you can see, the nozzle is rubbing the first layer and it creates a rough texture. The extruder gears are also not functioning like they should be. The nozzle oddly starts dripping later on right before it finally goes on to the 3rd layer. This only happens with cura. I even upgraded my ender 5 pro standard extruder and hotend to the microswiss extruder and hotend with a new stepper and the same thing is happening.         https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0abXhhXfw8M

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    Posted (edited) · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    For that gcode file - did you have "Ironing" turned on in Cura?  It looks like there is way to much motion on each layer for such a small part.

    The Z progresses by 0.2 layer by layer.  No problem there.

    The "Initial Layer Line Width" looks very narrow and leaves a poor finish on layer 0.

     

    So it prints a layer and goes back and irons the layer extruding very little material, then it moves up to the next layer and does the same thing again.  Print a layer, iron the layer, print a layer, iron the layer, etc.  That makes it look like it isn't advancing the Z, but it is.

     

    If you could go to File | Save Project and post a 3mf file, that would be helpful.  But right now I would call it expected behavior that is do to your settings.

     

    EDIT: I found the clip on Thingiverse.  I'm attaching a gcode file.  I print PLA cooler at 210 (and white at 200) and with the bed at 50.  I lowered the retraction to 1.5 for your direct drive.  The file should print on your E5 without alteration BUT never blindly run a gcode file that someone else sliced.

     

    As Gr5 says "Steppers are mostly indestructable and never fail."

     

    GV_Chip_Bag_Clip_Small.gcode

    Edited by GregValiant
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    Posted (edited) · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    I just used the standard setting for esun pla+ on cura which requires a minimum temperature of 205. I only changed the layer height to .2, the temperature up because of my all metal nozzle and my retraction settings for the direct drive. I never enabled ironing. You are correct with the poor finish on layer 0 but once again I never used to have that problem. These standard settings used to work fine for my printers besides the standard retraction settings. I do not understand. I tried your gcode and it does not produce the rubbing on every second layer but that gcode is wild and definitely does not work properly for my printers. That is an interesting start gcode though; I have never seen that loop along the side. I attached the .3mf , thanks. Also, I chose the chip bag clip because it shows and obvious example of my issues. I will continue using simplify 3d unless I can figure this issue out.

    CE5_Chip_Bag_Clip_V7_Small.3mf

    Edited by naziplanet
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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    @naziplanet that 3mf file is just the model.  Please use "File | Save Project" to generate the 3mf file.  It will include your model, your printer, and your settings.  Then post the Project file here.

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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    There isn't any doubt about it.  You had "Enable Ironing" turned on and "Iron Only Highest Layer" was turned off.  All layers were ironed so effectively, all layers in that file were printed twice.

    Further proof is that the term ";TYPE:SKIN" appears in your Gcode file 630 times.  It appears in my Gcode file 8 times (4 bottom and 4 top  layers).

    At the top of the settings is the Settings Search box.  To the right of that is a drop-down menu.  Select that menu and choose "All" for settings visibility.  Then go through ALL of them and set the model up the way you like and create a 3mf Project file, and post it.

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    Posted (edited) · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    I believe you but I promise on my end it was showing the "enable ironing" unchecked! I made sure of that multiple times. You are correct though when I just did click on it and check it on, it showed "iron only highest layer" was unchecked. I included the correct .3mf file you are talking about. I checked and unchecked it and did another print and I am still facing the same issue.

    new test.3mf

    Edited by naziplanet
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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    That looks much better.  Your print speed would be high for a larger part (but you know your own machines) but on that particular part, acceleration at 500 will keep the actual speed down.  If that one prints well you should be good to go.  I print industrial kind of things and typically print at 60.  If I want a decent finish (especially with silkies) I drop the outer wall speed to 35.

     

    BTW There was another Ender 5 THREAD a couple days ago about the fact that the build space is rotated compared to other printers.  I put a little workaround together.  It's a "Platform" with the Ender logo and the Zrods that makes it easier to tell which way you are looking at the machine.  If you are using the generic Ender 5 printer definition, you can download the Zip file from that other thread and follow the instructions in my post and it will work for you.

     

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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    Greg is talking about this thread:

     

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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    I appreciate your help but this feels like a lost cause. I tried printing the exact final file I posted and it is doing the exact same thing as before even though the file "looks much better'. I guess both of my printers are now failing me because we have tried everything else. RIP. Maybe I should save up for a lulzbot. Thanks.

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    Posted (edited) · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    .

    Edited by naziplanet
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    Posted · Nozzle scratching print every second layer with no extrusion

    Because there are two printers involved I discounted that possibility of a mechanical problem but maybe gr5 nailed it when he brought up the Z mechanicals.  Before you chuck them out a window, double check the Z couplers and the set screws.  Print a gcode file with two lines:

    G28

    G1 X10 Y10 Z125 F600

    Then scale the height of the nozzle from the bed.  If it's 125 then I'm lost as well.

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