Comparison of Ultimaker 2 to Mankati XT

[blackomega 2]

Hi guys.

Sorry for late reply but I haven't had much time to make some comparison for you.

Anyway, here's our setup:

 

 

I didn't upgrade our Flashforge with additional cooling fan yet but I gonna do it later this week, everything is waiting for me

 

 

You've asked for Ultimaker Robot so here you go.

Slicer used for Flashforge - Simplify3D, 0.2mm layer hight, 40mm/s, 10 seconds minimal layer time.

Slicer used for Ultimaker 2 - I've used original gcode which come with the printed on SD card, so don't know what's the settings are used by Ultimaker team.

 

 

 

 

Result - 1:0 for Flashforge even without cooling fan

 

 

 

 

 

Ok, another round.

I gonna give another chance to UM2 by using exact same slicer and exact same settings as for Flashforge. This time Simplify3D for UM2

 

 

 

 

 

Result - 2:0 for Flashforge Creator Pro also known as "cheap Chinese rubbish printer"

 

 

 

 

 

 

For Flashforge I've used really cheap filament from reprap.me Denmark ( €13.33 for 1kg !) http://reprap.me/filament/pla-1-7mm

UM2 were using white Ultimaker PLA (€31.50 for 750 gram) https://shop.ultimaker.com/product/18/PLAWhite

BTW Flashforge Creator Pro comes with Sailfish accelerated firmware right out of the box which is great.

I've also recorded some video

 

Is that some sort of print head cover you've got there on the UM2? An upgrade?

 

[opit78 0]

You mean fan duct ?

You can find it here https://www.youmagine.com/designs/fan-base-um2

 

[Anders Olsson 136]

Thank you for your efforts comparing the printers opit78!

I would say that your last Ultimaker robot is about as good as it gets with the UM2.

For my projects, the print quality of my UM2 has been significantly better than what I really need, but it is still interesting to see that the Flashforge obviously can perform even better.

Do you get the same printing times for a certain object in both printers? (if you print at the same speed, layer height, wall thickness and infill level)

I was thinking, the light weight head of the UM2 is one of the marketing points, but is the Flashforge significantly slower at infill at narrow sections? For example if you print the torque wrench housing with 100% infill and 0.8 mm walls: https://www.youmagine.com/designs/nozzle-torque-wrench

A dual extrusion test would also be highly interesting, as I mentioned before.

 

[foehnsturm 969]

Print time would be interesting. If I compare different hotends, extruders or filaments on the UMO I always try to go for the same print time, e.g. some 30 min for a high quality UM robot (I prefer the "old" robot as the new one is more forgiving).

 

[opit78 0]

If you use the same slicer (for example as myself, Simplify3D) and the same speed settings then both printers will finish at that same time, only difference will be acceleration and jerk speeds which can be different in each printer.

Nozzle diameter is also the same so no difference here either.

At this moment all acceleration speed in my Flashforge is set to "quality", but you can also set it for "speed" or completely manually if you like.

With Sailfish firmware you can go really crazy with acceleration speed without losing quality that's for sure.

In my previous video you could see exact same item printed (black stand with UM2 and White UV stand with Flashforge) however two different slicers were used, Cura for UM2 and Makerbot Markerware for Flashforge.

Cura:

0.2mm layer hight

250mm/s movement speed

20mm/s first layer

50mm/s printing speed

30mm/s printing speed for outer wall

15% infill

Makerware:

0.2mm layer hight

150mm/s movement speed

20mm/s first layer

90mm/s printing speed

40mm/s printing speed for outer wall

20% infill

UM2 needed 2:40h to finish it were Flashforge was ready in 1:38h with significantly better quality.

Yesterday I've 3D printed some other test items.

I'am so impressed with quality of sharp or "pointy" edges, UM2 used to give us some mess at this points (small blob of filament instead of sharp/pointy finish)

As for dual extrusion we haven't done much yet.

You have to remember that before you print anything with two extruders you can to calibrate them properly for every filament unless you need just "OK"quality.

You are dealing with two extruders so you have to perform extrusion test for each extruder separately, each extruder must extrude exact same amount of filament.

Below you can se my very first attempt for dual extrusion print

In our case thing were different because we needed dual extruder 3D printer only to be able to print more complicated models which require a lot of support (which now can be printed with PVA filament and dissolved).

You also have to remember about "purge walls" otherwise your dual extrusion print will be complete mess !!

That's really bad example (no purge walls)

 

 

[foehnsturm 969]

Regarding extrusion control and preciseness I would consider the Flashforge at least one step ahead of the UM. The direct extruder and the firmware should be responsible for that.

This would be even of more value without the echoing which can be seen after sharp corners. It's as always, the lightweight UM head should give you better positioning quality at higher speed but the current extrusion system falls behind. The Flashforge extrusion system could deliver super sharp corners at high speed but the heavy printhead causes other issues which will limit max speed.

 

[nallath 1,120]

Yeah, thats why stuff like the flexi-drive has a lot of potential; The advantage of direct drive, but only very little extra weight on the head.

 

[opit78 0]

Actually I can see much more "echoing" effect on UM2's prints to be honest. At this moment one of our UM2's is set to 1000 for acceleration and 10 for Jerk to avoid that effect.

I would love to see some upgrade coming to UM2, direct drive (flex-drive) and 1.75mm filament.

Direct drive with 1.75mm is so precise !

Ultimaker - please think about it.

Working with 2.85mm filament and bowden tube can be (and it actually really is) very unstable.

I would like to see 1.75mm filament in your offer as well. I don't understand why you're limiting your sale only to 2.85mm.

I know, yours printers use only 2.85mm but there is a huge market for 1.75mm filaments

 

[Anders Olsson 136]

With Sailfish firmware you can go really crazy with acceleration speed without losing quality that's for sure.

In my previous video you could see exact same item printed (black stand with UM2 and White UV stand with Flashforge) however two different slicers were used, Cura for UM2 and Makerbot Markerware for Flashforge.

............

UM2 needed 2:40h to finish it were Flashforge was ready in 1:38h with significantly better quality.

 

That model is very suitable for printers with heavy head though, like the Flashforge, since the head does not have to change direction often and the most sudden changes in direction is in the infill.

Most things I design look very different. They often end up with lots of narrow sections with varying width and 100% infill.

When printing with the UM2, the head is just rattling back and forth making a buzzing sound, almost magically making that infill faster than the eye can capture.

The torque wrench housing that I linked to in previous posts is a good example.

The common understanding is that printers carrying three motors on the gantry/head, like the Flashforge, will be significantly slower than light head printers like the UM2 when printing infill on narrow sections since the head is too heavy to accelerate that quickly.

Now, if it turns out that the light head of the UM2 has no advantage over the heavy Flashforge head at narrow sections infill, the design of the UM2 is kind of dead in my opinion.

That is because the direct feeder has obvious advantages for precision extrusion and the Flashforge gantry design allows for linear ball bearings on all axis, which has advantages when it come to friction and precision.

That is why I keep on asking about for a video of something which requires a lot of acceleration (which I have not seen the Flashforge doing yet).

It would be interesting to see this one printed by the Flashforge for example: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:289650

Preferably cranking up the speed a bit more than I did: