First Layer very thin since 14.12.1

[mghtbgiant 0]

I have recently made the jump up to Cura 14.12.1 from 14.09. I am noticing now, my first layer is printing ridiculously thin. It is possible that this could have been an issue with 14.09 where it was putting down too much material on the first layer and I was just used to it whereas now it's doing it more "correctly"?

I will say one thing.. with this "new" initial layer... my prints are sticking more than ever to the printbed. And, sometimes this is detrimental to the finished product!

Any ideas?

 

[pm_dude 27]

Can you provide a bit more info?

Did you do the firmware update?

Did you redo the bed leveling?

Maybe your initial layer setting changed in Cura. What is the value now?

What do you mean to the detriment of the quality of the print? High adhesion is usualy good.

[mghtbgiant 0]

I did apply the firmware update. I also did a factory reset on the unit and went through releveling everything. The initial layer setting was set to (I believe the default of 0.0). EDIT: I believe the default is 0.0. It was definitely set to 0.0. My statement was ambiguous possibly suggesting I didn't know what it was set to. This print was set to .2mm layer height. And, I realize this isn't very high. However, on 14.09, I was very used to a much thicker looking initial layer. I thought maybe there was a bug in the initial layer 0.0 rolling over to the main layer height value, but I manually changed the initial layer to .2 and it didn't change anything. So, my guess is that it's now actually printing a .2mm initial layer where 14.09 was printing something far thicker.

And, by "detrimental to the finished product" I mean, the prints are SOO stuck to the print bed, they are very stubborn to remove which has ruined the bottoms of some of the parts I'm printing. I am waiting for it to cool but only to where the machine says the print is finished. I am going to let this part that I'm printing right now cool down even more to see if that helps.

Basically, it's almost as if the initial layer is coming out like a thin layer of glue rather than a layer of the print. It's translucent and has to be razored off after the print is removed. Before, I would remove the print and the glass would be (mostly) spotless.

 

[pm_dude 27]

That simply mean you did your bed leveling to close, the nozzle is now to close to the print bed. Start a new print and adjust the level using the 3 screw (clockwise will lower the bed).

Well applied PLA should be removed once the build plate is back to room temp. I think the sign saying you can remove your print wait for the nozzle only to cool down. I can sometime ear the piece pop out when near room temp.

[mghtbgiant 0]

I lowered the bed from how I would level it in the past. I've been releveling a lot lately trying to play with how the first layer is put down. In the past, I've had the bed very close results in superfluous squish which creates a ridge around the base of the print.

I don't mean to sound all "no, that's not it". I very much appreciate your help.

[peggyb 169]

(clockwise will lower the bed). ?????

I remember your nice add on: https://www.youmagine.com/designs/um2-bed-leveling-guide#!design-information

where clockwise will raise the bed….

 

[pm_dude 27]

You need to align your view to the screw top which is under the build plate. From the screw head point of view it is turning clockwise to lower.

But yes the addon make it fool proof even for me

[peggyb 169]

viewpoints are confusing.. :???:

your add-on helps very much!

 

[mghtbgiant 0]

In a crazy turn of events... removing the print I was doing yesterday actually pitted out part of the glass from the build-plate!!! How does that even happen?!? And, more importantly, who do I talk to to get it fixed?

I was printing with ColorFabb XT material.

This is bananas. I let this thing completely cool for hours after the print was finished.

 

[pm_dude 27]

Yeah I've seen other having that issue. Maybe you had a small scratch and the XT just got really into it.

You can contact support to get a replacement glass or get one from the store.

https://shop.ultimaker.com/product/60/Print-Table-Glass

Turn the glass around in the mean time.

 

[mghtbgiant 0]

And, I can't log into support.ultimaker.com. Wonderful. I was planning on just flipping over the plate but I don't think what happened is "normal" or should've happened.

And, I'm still curious as to what's causing the initial layer funkiness. Maybe it thinks it's printing a very thin raft? I don't ever print with a raft but that's something I thought late last night to check.

 

[yellowshark 153]

wow! I am staying away from 14.12.1; the next one will be it tore the bed off its mounts :eek:

 

[mghtbgiant 0]

wow! I am staying away from 14.12.1; the next one will be it tore the bed off its mounts :eek:

 

Are you saying you've experienced similar gluing?? I see there were some versions of Cura I skipped between 14.09 and 14.12.1 but I didn't use those. So, it's possible what I am experiencing isn't directly related to 14.12.1.

I still can't fathom the issue unless the firmware is doing something behind the scenes like pushing out a "pre-initial-layer" at the highest resolution possible before laying down the actual first layer.

I haven't seen anything about it in the forums so there is a high likelihood it's only happening to me. But, if you're saying you've been having problems removing your prints maybe I'm not the only one!!

 

[tinydancer 0]

Let your bed cool to room temperature, then take it out and put it in the fridge for 20 minutes. The part will come off easily after that as the glass and plastic cool at different rates.

 

[mghtbgiant 0]

I left this print on the bed for many hours after it was finished. I have never, ever, removed the build plate and put it in a fridge. I do not use any sort of additional adhesive for my prints as I've always had great luck with pressing the PLA straight onto the glass.

 

[tinydancer 0]

I'm just telling you what works if a print won't come off the plate. You mentioned ruining your parts when my suggestion will prevent that.

 

[yellowshark 153]

Sure it wasn't the new XTsuperglue material you were using, I thought it was still under Beta.

Seriously, I have two comments. personally I find that the translucent filaments can be misleading. If you get external light shining into the build area, one part of the layer can look OK whereas another part can look really thin. If it is not that then I would say it has to be bed level/nozzle distance.

Personally I would swap to a normal PLA, load up a cube and set it to 0.2 or .3 height and maybe set it to a 100*100 on the X/Y plane and then follow pm-dudes suggestion for levelling on the fly. Once happy go back to XT. I have never used XT, if it needs an adjustment to the nozzle distance leave the screws alone and use a z-offset to get it.

 

[mghtbgiant 0]

Appreciated. The main point of this thread is about the ultra-fine first layer I have been experiencing since moving from 14.09 to 14.12.1. The ruined prints is a side-effect. I'm curious if anyone else is seeing this.

 

[yellowshark 153]

Sorry, no I was just being light hearted. It must be very frustrating, sometimes you just have to smile

 

[mghtbgiant 0]

Sure it wasn't the new XTsuperglue material you were using, I thought it was still under Beta.

Seriously, I have two comments. personally I find that the translucent filaments can be misleading. If you get external light shining into the build area, one part of the layer can look OK whereas another part can look really thin. If it is not that then I would say it has to be bed level/nozzle distance.

Personally I would swap to a normal PLA, load up a cube and set it to 0.2 or .3 height and maybe set it to a 100*100 on the X/Y plane and then follow pm-dudes suggestion for levelling on the fly. Once happy go back to XT. I have never used XT, if it needs an adjustment to the nozzle distance leave the screws alone and use a z-offset to get it.

 

This wasn't specifically isolated to the XT, that just happened to be what I was using when the glass just broke. I do use all ColorFabb products, though.

Maybe I take this opportunity to try to print something that's never worked because it always breaks free from the platform!

In any case, I'll try to set up a camera and film what's happening. I've had the printer for about 3 months and have printed.. a LOT on it. I've leveled/re-leveled/re-re-leveled. I did see one print going where it was getting too squished on one side and had to adjust it on the fly and it flattened out nicely.

I'm getting more and more of the feeling that something is going on with my machine and no one else has seen this.

 

[yellowshark 153]

Were you printing with XT before the software change?

 

[yellowshark 153]

Our posts crossed. I asked the question because to me, translucent materials always look thinner. I have always assumed they are not!!!!!

 

[mghtbgiant 0]

Were you printing with XT before the software change?

 

Yes. The only materials I have on-hand are the single roll of green Ultimaker filament that came with the printer and all the rest are ColorFabb products: XT Black, XT Purple, and a bunch of PLA/PHA filaments. I've printed lots of things in both materials.. many hours worth. I've had great prints and bad prints (mostly the bad ones are when I'm fumbling with settings seeing what does what).

 

[mghtbgiant 0]

Our posts crossed. I asked the question because to me, translucent materials always look thinner. I have always assumed they are not!!!!!

 

Gotcha. I am not using any translucents. All I have used, to date, are all solid colors.

 

[yellowshark 153]

i.e. thinner on the 1st layer