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jdaiglejr

UM2 Dual Extruder, wifi add-on and Octoprint - installation by novices?

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I am considering purchasing the UM2, but this will be my first printer. I am at beginner level when it comes to upgrading, etc. I read that the dual extruder will come out in the future and also the wifi add-on.

Am I better off waiting until these are integrated, or will the 2nd extruder and nozzle be simple enough to install that it should not be a concern?

Secondly, is the "wifi enabling" in the future only through the Doodle 3d, or will it eventually be built-in? How does this integrate with Octoprint, if at all, or does that require me to install a Raspberry Pi and webcam myself?

The new machine looks so much more like a finished product compared to the original - how hard is it to get inside and install a RPi or a new extruder, without a beginner throwing everything else out of tuning?

I am somewhat mechanically inclined, but certainly no engineer.

Thanks

 

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I'm not sure what UM's plans are regarding wifi-enabling, but both the Doodle 3D and/or Octoprint solutions just connect to the printer over USB, as far as I know. So adding one or other of those is pretty trivial.

The printer is a little more polished than it's predecessor, but it's all still fundamentally the same technology. And it's not really a fiddly design that needs super careful calibration or ultra-fine tolerances. It's just a couple of motors pulling around a hot block of metal, with a pointy bit on it. There's not much magic really. The slicing software and firmware is moderately clever, and the hardware of the UM2 is a bit more refined for reliability. But if you're 'mechanically inclined' at all, I don't think there's any reason to feel intimidated by it, and adding a second extruder shouldn't be too difficult. :-)

 

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Thanks Illuminarti,

I think I saw you over on the Qu-Bd forums - I had an RMP on order until I cancelled recently. They held my money for almost a year, and still haven't shipped any, I believe....

Now I'm looking at this new UM2 as a resplacement for printing. I assume you have both this and an RXL? How is the RXL working in comparison?

 

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I have an original Ultimaker, and and RXL. And a UM2 on order.

The original UM is a far more polished printer than the RXL, at this point. And from what I saw using the UM2 at Maker Faire, for a couple of days, I think it will be even more reliable and usable.

I think the RXL has a lot of potential, but it still needs work to iron out some of the kinks, and refine some of the fit and finish. For instance, I had to design and install a totally new Z-endstop arrangement on the RXL, because the built-in one was neither adjustable, nor repeatable. Several others have now adopted the same mod. I know what I'm doing with 3D printers, and it took me a couple of days to get the RXL to print anything, and I still wouldn't say that I really trust it to print reliably, whereas I pretty much never have a problem with the UM1.

On the other hand, the underlying mechanics of the RXL are really good, and it's a very solid frame, and pretty cheap compared to a UM2. And it seems that the UM2 is having a few teething problems of its own, in terms of some people seeing some shipping damage etc, and there were some firmware issues that were already fixed. At this point though, I don't think that the RXL is a particularly good choice for someone without a strong background in 3D printing already. That could change, given a bit more time, but it's not there yet.

You've been on the QU-BD forums, so you're well aware of the communication and support issues that have plagued QU-BD... while UM has been unfortunately swamped the last few weeks by the launch and roll-out of the UM2, in general they are very responsive, and even when the folks back at HQ are inundated, these forums are always busy with people looking for help, and getting it from the large number of very knowledgable users in the Ultimaker community. Also, I believe the fact that UM has Daid and others on staff who are actively developing both Cura and the Marlin firmware gives them a huge advantage over other companies that are just hardware companies, and not actively developing the software and firmware side of things.

So, bottom line - the QU-BD printers have potential. But, if you're at all nervous that the UM2 might prove challenging because you're inexperienced, then the QU-BD machines are definitely not the right machines for you right now, IMO. The original Ultimaker is a good printer that's relatively inexpensive, and putting the kit together would actually be a great way to learn about the mechanics of 3D printing. I think that the UM2 would also be a great choice for a more polished design that's designed to be more plug-and-play (although at this point no 3D printers truly are - you need to be prepared to learn how to get the best from them, and experiment). The UM2 is a new machine, and there may be some hiccups yet, but from what I've seen as a customer of UM's for 18 months, and an active member of this forum, I think that they (and the community) will stand behind the product and help you get the very best out of it.

 

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illumiarti,

My RPM cancellation refund check should be here shortly, so it's time to make a decision.

Regarding UM vs. UM2, I noticed one comment by Sander wherein he states:

"Be aware that the Ultimaker Original requires a bit more technical knowledge to operate then the Ultimaker²."

On the other hand, you suggest the original UM may have more of its kinks worked out, while the UM2 still has some "teething problems". Care to elaborate? Looking at the forum, I can see that certain issues are being addressed. What are the ongoing issues you still see?

 

Note, I saw they offer the UM on the Makershed website also, some are pre-built with dual extruder, and are discounted because they were used in a display at a Makerfaire. Shipping is less, coming from U.S.

There is a rumor I read elsewhere, that they will soon have the UM2 also.

I saw the warranty/return on Makershed is 30 days. Do you know the warranty/return policy on orders directly through Ultimaker?

 

 

 

Finally, taking a tangent regarding dual extrusion - has anyone tried using ABS in one extruder, as a support for PLA printing from the other extruder, and then dissolving in Acetone? Would that work?

 

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Finally, taking a tangent regarding dual extrusion - has anyone tried using ABS in one extruder, as a support for PLA printing from the other extruder, and then dissolving in Acetone? Would that work?

 

It's extremely hard to disolve ABS in acetone, I've tried it and the result was that the PLA also had problems due to the acetone acting on it.

HIPS seems to be a possible way forward. Still in testing phase, but easy to print (easier then ABS), and not as expensive as PVA. Still looking for the best solvent.

 

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illumiarti,

My RPM cancellation refund check should be here shortly, so it's time to make a decision.

Regarding UM vs. UM2, I noticed one comment by Sander wherein he states:

"Be aware that the Ultimaker Original requires a bit more technical knowledge to operate then the Ultimaker²."

On the other hand, you suggest the original UM may have more of its kinks worked out, while the UM2 still has some "teething problems". Care to elaborate? Looking at the forum, I can see that certain issues are being addressed. What are the ongoing issues you still see?

 

Note, I saw they offer the UM on the Makershed website also, some are pre-built with dual extruder, and are discounted because they were used in a display at a Makerfaire. Shipping is less, coming from U.S.

There is a rumor I read elsewhere, that they will soon have the UM2 also.

I saw the warranty/return on Makershed is 30 days. Do you know the warranty/return policy on orders directly through Ultimaker?

 

 

 

Finally, taking a tangent regarding dual extrusion - has anyone tried using ABS in one extruder, as a support for PLA printing from the other extruder, and then dissolving in Acetone? Would that work?

 

I think Sander is mostly referring to the fact that there's a bit more smarts built into the firmware of a UM2, and it also offers a heated bed, and supposedly more reliable designs for the hot end and extruder. So It's intended to be more of a plug and play kind of device. But the reality is that all these types of printers - from any manufacturer - still require quite a bit of user expertise to keep them running, and get the best out of them. Fundamentally both UM models are the same technology, and will require roughly the same level of knowledge to work with successfully. But if you read the documentation, you should be able to get some nice prints out of it without much fuss, and will learn as you use it, and read the forums, wiki, etc.

Compare that with my experience as an RXL owner. I've been using 3D printers for 18 months, and would say I'm on the upper end of the user spectrum in terms of experience – and It took me two days to get the first print out of my RXL, and now, 7 weeks later, I've only really gotten one really good print, and a handful of ok quality ones. So far, I've had to replace the head fan, Y-axis homing switch bracket, Z-end stop microswitch, extruder motor wiring loom, and to design a totally new z-end stop activation system, since the built-in one is neither adjustable nor repeatable.

The only even significant work I've done on my UM1 was fitting the revised hot end and extruder upgrades. Those have worked flawlessly now for a year or more, and since they come as standard these days, won't be something you'd have to worry with. At this point, I'd say that my UM1 'just works' - my print success rate is getting up towards 100%. Pretty much the only time prints go wrong is when I'm deliberately pushing the envelope to see how big it is.

So far as the UM2, I don't have one yet, so can't really comment much beyond what I've seen here, although I used one for a couple of days at Maker Faire New York. The issues seem to be related mostly to shipping damage, plus some firmware-related things that have already been fixed. Oh, and some people seem to be having issues with the new extruder drive, although whether that is something about the mechanism, or just a failure to operate it exactly right, I'm really not sure. Whatever issues it has, it doesn't seem to be on the scale of the QU-BD printers, and the support is certainly a lot better, albeit a bit strained by the logistics of this hugely successful product launch.

 

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illuminarti,

I just watched your video over on the Qu-Bd forum - your "Christmas card" being printed on what is unmistakably an Ultimaker - are you taunting them?

Neat print.

 

Thanks, but no - not taunting, just livening up a discussion of printing on kapton tape. Mind you, it doesn't hurt to show 3D printer enthusiasts stuff printing successfully, every now and then. Not much of that on the QU-BD forums at the moment :-)

 

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Pretty much anyone you ask here has a UM Original so they are all going to be biased towards it. It works. You can get one much faster (probably just a week but certainly less than 2 weeks - they are probably ready to ship sitting on a shelf unlike the UM2s which are about 5-6 weeks wait for now). Ask Illuminarti in a month or a year when he's printed many things on his UM2 (which he doesn't have quite yet).

 

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Hello, this is my first post on this forum as I have bought a UM2 which will be shipped soon. I have a question regarding the dual extruder which I hope someone can answer. I downloaded the user manual for the UM2 and noticed that there is only one slot on the back for a spool holder so how will this work with a dual extruder kit?

Thank you.

 

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The spool holder is long enough to hold 2 normal spools. (If you have different spools, you could always print one of the many stand alone spool holders from thingiverse)

On the wifi part, I received my Doodle3D box early, and I've played a bit with the API for it, I already manage to make a wireless print. Only issue I had so far with it that connecting it to the Ultimaker wifi did not seem to work reliably, so I'm using it in access-point mode.

I'm hoping to add this to Cura in the December release.

I do have to say that they made a very nice product, really easy to use. Not only the application is easy to use, it's also easy to setup.

 

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