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First layer ripples, no matter what i try


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Posted · First layer ripples, no matter what i try

Hello

Does anyone have any idea what could be causing these first layer ripples ? I have a Creality Ender 5 Pro with ABL levelling. The z- offset is has perfect has i can get it.

 

I have tried various temps, flow rates etc but no luck. I doesnt really affect the print quality has the second layer covers it up and the adhesion is also good, apart from the damn ripples !!

 

Thanks

 

IMG_20240604_142712284_HDR.jpg

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    Posted (edited) · First layer ripples, no matter what i try

    I know this is completely unhelpful, but I never figured it out.  I tried a lot of different things and finally when I ran out of the particular roll of filament, it went away.  It happened a couple of years ago with a single roll of filament, and then happed again last fall with another roll of PLA but a different color and same manufacturer and supplier.

     

    Could it have been the filament?  It would seem so.  Maybe the filament has some moisture in if from the factory (some steam bubbles pushing it up?).  That's something I have seen but maybe something else changed like the humidity, when the air conditioning turned on and blew across the room, or maybe I printed PETG and then went right to PLA without cleaning the bed...dunno.

     

    Fortunately it's livable as far as the print goes, and it will likely go away by itself...until the next time.

     

      

    Edited by GregValiant
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    Posted · First layer ripples, no matter what i try
    2 hours ago, GregValiant said:

    I know this is completely unhelpful, but I never figured it out.  I tried a lot of different things and finally when I ran out of the particular roll of filament, it went away.  It happened a couple of years ago with a single roll of filament, and then happed again last fall with another roll of PLA but a different color and same manufacturer and supplier.

     

    Could it have been the filament?  It would seem so.  Maybe the filament has some moisture in if from the factory (some steam bubbles pushing it up?).  That's something I have seen but maybe something else changed like the humidity, when the air conditioning turned on and blew across the room, or maybe I printed PETG and then went right to PLA without cleaning the bed...dunno.

     

    Fortunately it's livable as far as the print goes, and it will likely go away by itself...until the next time.

     

      

     

    I thought perhaps it was the filament, but its happened now in several rolls and two different brands. I get it on most prints i do unfortunately. 

     

    Its almost like a reaction between the filament and the PEI bed but i dont know why. Its funny though that when a line starts to lift the rest follow on like a wave which gives that weird ripple affect.

     

    It just annoys me when i cant figure something out.

     

    Any other ideas or anyone else getting the same problem?

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    Posted · First layer ripples, no matter what i try

    I had the exact same problem on the UM2+ we have at work. I struggled with it for sooo long and it didn't matter what color, brand or even type of filament I used. PLA, PETG and ABS all did the same thing to some degree.

     

    The thing that eventually turned out to be the problem was that I adjusted the bed to be too close to the nozzle, since it was manually adjusted. When I redid the bed leveling and learned to do it by eye instead of with the provided paper you're supposed to use as a measure, it finally went away. It was almost as if when the nozzle got too close to the bed, it kind of pulled the filament up behind it when it was moving. Think like if you have a rubbery sheet and press an object against it on a flat surface while at the same time pulling the object sideways, the rubber will "rise" behind the object you're moving. Might be a confusing description, but hopefully you understand what I mean. My best guess is that a similar effect caused my problems. 

     

    But since you have ABL this probably isn't the case for you. I still wanted to mention it though, in case it could help in some way.

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    Posted (edited) · First layer ripples, no matter what i try

    I wasn't in love with the "filament theory" and you guys seem to have smashed it anyway.

    Doing a "single layer" print and then measuring the actual thickness, and using that number to touch up the Z-offset might have some value.  It can't hurt.

     

    This is my current leveling routine.  It works for me.

    I give the bed a good bath with dish detergent and then wipe it down with 90% IPA.  I use Aquanet Super Hold hairspray as an adhesion promoter for PETG and nothing for PLA.  (There are dedicated products as well.)  It's been a long time since I've had the Rippling problem.  I level with a piece of "parchment paper" and over time I've gotten very consistent.

    I did make a change to my leveling process.  I noticed that my Z-endstop switch (Ender 3 Pro) isn't very consistent.  I would carefully level the bed, and then the print would start, and there would be "G28" in the StartUp which homed the Z again.  Too many times the "new" Z position wasn't exactly the same as the Z position was when I leveled.  I changed the line in the StartUp Gcode to "G28 X Y".

    Now, when the print starts, the Z is the same as it was during leveling.  That won't work with an ABL, but for the other 3 people left in the world that manually level - it might help.

    That kind of points to @43915's suggestion that the real, actual, "Initial Layer Height" might come into play.

     

    Edited by GregValiant
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    Posted · First layer ripples, no matter what i try

    Interesting, I do believe that our printer does a Z homing at the start of each print as well, never thought about it perhaps not being consistent.

     

    I wonder if our printer ends up at the same "wrong" Z-height each time it homes before printing, and that's why following the bed leveling sequence won't work very well for me. Perhaps the way I've gotten used to level it by eye compensates for that deviation and makes it work better in the end after the bed homes again. Very interesting indeed.

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    Posted · First layer ripples, no matter what i try

    The 3 end stop switches on my Ender are all the same and so they would be interchangeable.  The switches are mounted to circuit boards which I've assumed are "anti-bounce" circuits so the switches send a single on\off signal rather than a series of "on-offs".  That's nice but doesn't address the accuracy.  I don't see any point to swapping them around.

     

    The longer the lever arm on the switch, the greater the repeatability/accuracy of the switch.  Mine are really short.  In addition, they are exactly the same level of quality as things like the fans.  I've had to replace all the fans.  The layer cooling fan lasted about a month.  Compared to the plastic extruder arms that wasn't too bad.  The plastic pressure arms have a 100% failure rate and some Enders were delivered with pre-broken pressure arms.

     

    I've had to come up with a lot of workarounds to get this thing to print well (and it prints very well thank you).  The "G28 X Y" is just one example.

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    Posted · First layer ripples, no matter what i try

    Thanks for the thoughts guys. I will try backing off the z-offset slightly. I normally have problems with small intricate parts sticking when i do but its worth a try. 

     

    I don't think the nozzle is too low has when you watch it extruding the filament the tip of the nozzle is just slightly above the line of plastic its extruding, not squashing it, if you know what i mean.

     

     

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    Posted · First layer ripples, no matter what i try

    Yeah, I doubt you're having the same problem as me if that's the case. I don't think I'm of any more help then, but good luck finding whatever is causing your issues!

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