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UMO+ with E3d V6: Struggling to find the right PID settings / maintain set point during build


jambalyle
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Posted (edited) · UMO+ with E3d V6: Struggling to find the right PID settings / maintain set point during build

I've recently installed the E3D V6 hotend on my UMO+  using the existing heater block, heater, and pt100. Unfortunately, I haven't had much success printing yet. The biggest problem seems to be the temperature variation. I'll overshoot the set point, then fall under, and then slowly build back up and hold at the set point ± 2 C. That is until the fans kick on, at which point my nozzle temp drops 10 - 15 C and pretty much never makes it back up to the set point, at least not in enough time to make an acceptable print. I say that because is dose seem like the temperature starts to climb, but oh so slowly and because the temp has fallen so far below the set point I start seeing significant under extrusion.

I ran the PID autotune [M303 S200 C8] and got these values:

Kp = 10.33

Ki = 0.35

Kd = 76.70

Like an idiot I didn't write down what the original PID settings for my UMO + were and don't know where to look for them.

Are my PID settings to blame? or is there something else going on? One thought I had was that the layer cooling fans might be drawing voltage away from the heater, but it's just two 12v fans. Unless I'm missing something the electronics on my UMO+ (whiteboard) are the same as the UM2 which also has two layer cooling fans and the same heater cartridge.

I'm also wondering if the fans are just cooling the nozzle / block and throwing everything off, but I'm using a mount that I've seen lot of folks use so it seems odd that I'd be the only one with the problem.

Here are some photos of the build:

IMG_7694.thumb.JPG.f27f582c0eb7096cd811a826fd6ae9a1.JPG

IMG_7695.thumb.JPG.da1f81bbbf4a162df5c31daa8841836b.JPG

Is it a firmware thing (my ulticontroller says I'm using 15.04.4)? Is the Marlin PID Autotune prone to error?

Any help would be appreciated.

IMG_7694.thumb.JPG.f27f582c0eb7096cd811a826fd6ae9a1.JPG

IMG_7695.thumb.JPG.da1f81bbbf4a162df5c31daa8841836b.JPG

Edited by Guest
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    • 2 weeks later...
    Posted · UMO+ with E3d V6: Struggling to find the right PID settings / maintain set point during build

    I've tried changing the PID settings on the fly using the Ulti-Controller but still am having pretty big temperature swings and some not so great prints.

    The biggest drop happens once the fans come one and aside from any air bouncing off the print plate, none of the fans are blowing on the heater itself. My suspicion is that it is either a current / voltage problem or just a PID settings issue.

    Any help would be appreciated.

    Cheers,

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    Posted · UMO+ with E3d V6: Struggling to find the right PID settings / maintain set point during build

    I have an E3Dv6 on my UMO as well, and before that, an E3Dv5 with the original UM heater block, heater and pt100... I never bothered to change my PID values and it still works fine.

    What i did do though, was to insulate my heater block in some ceramic cloth taped up with kapton... It makes heating much faster and stable, even with my very violent cross-flow fan constantly blowing directly at it with full speed...

    Its something like this I used:

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10PCS-2-5mm-thick-3d-printer-heating-block-cotton-hotend-nozzle-heat-insulation-/291607868829?hash=item43e52ef59d:g:4rUAAOSwmmxW350d

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    Posted · UMO+ with E3d V6: Struggling to find the right PID settings / maintain set point during build

    I have an E3Dv6 on my UMO as well, and before that, an E3Dv5 with the original UM heater block, heater and pt100... I never bothered to change my PID values and it still works fine.

    What i did do though, was to insulate my heater block in some ceramic cloth taped up with kapton... It makes heating much faster and stable, even with my very violent cross-flow fan constantly blowing directly at it with full speed...

    Its something like this I used:

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10PCS-2-5mm-thick-3d-printer-heating-block-cotton-hotend-nozzle-heat-insulation-/291607868829?hash=item43e52ef59d:g:4rUAAOSwmmxW350d

     

    Glad to hear it! I think I'll end up doing something similar to insulate the heater block. Any chance you can post those original PID settings? I stupidly changed mine using Marlin's PID autotune and forgot to write down the originals. I've reloaded the firmware, but that didn't reset the PID settings on the machine for some reason.

    Thanks for the tips!

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    Posted · UMO+ with E3d V6: Struggling to find the right PID settings / maintain set point during build

     

    I have an E3Dv6 on my UMO as well, and before that, an E3Dv5 with the original UM heater block, heater and pt100... I never bothered to change my PID values and it still works fine.

    What i did do though, was to insulate my heater block in some ceramic cloth taped up with kapton... It makes heating much faster and stable, even with my very violent cross-flow fan constantly blowing directly at it with full speed...

    Its something like this I used:

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10PCS-2-5mm-thick-3d-printer-heating-block-cotton-hotend-nozzle-heat-insulation-/291607868829?hash=item43e52ef59d:g:4rUAAOSwmmxW350d

     

    Glad to hear it! I think I'll end up doing something similar to insulate the heater block. Any chance you can post those original PID settings? I stupidly changed mine using Marlin's PID autotune and forgot to write down the originals. I've reloaded the firmware, but that didn't reset the PID settings on the machine for some reason.

    Thanks for the tips!

     

    Well I did change firmware a few times, so the PID values that I have now are not the original ones... Maybe you can just grab Marlin from GitHub and see what the defaults are in there, use those as a starting point? Has always worked for me...

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