Formfutura TitanX vs. OrbiTech SmarABS vs. Taulman Bridge Nylon

[shurik 87]

Hi mates,

I was asked to print a couple of details that will hold medical device components and battery which can get hot.

What's important to me is that its strong, heat resistant, accurate to print... and hopefully the exterior will be a nice texture too.

So I have Formfutura TitanX, OrbiTech SmarABS and Taulman Bridge Nylon. The later is really tricky to get printed decently.

Which one would you suggest for the best results?

[kmanstudios 1,120]

Have you tried to print in Polycarbonate? It has the highest TG threshold my research has found as well as no more difficult to print with. I actually have more successes with it than ABS.

Nylon can be too flexible and is hydroscopic.

[tomnagel 126]

You can try Ultimaker CPE+.

The benefit is that Cura has printing profiles for UM material built in, so you don't have to find optimal settings yourself. These profiles are improving with every release of Cura.

Look up the specs here: https://ultimaker.com/en/products/materials/cpe

[shurik 87]

Have you tried to print in Polycarbonate?

Right! How didn't I think about that? Of course! I have a spool of it - OrbitTech PC.

Thanks a lot for reminding me of that option.

[shurik 87]

You can try Ultimaker CPE+.

 

That's a good idea but I do not have one at my disposal, unlike the previously mentioned PC. But will check it, too, to be aware of.

Thanks!

[kmanstudios 1,120]

You can try Ultimaker CPE+.

The benefit is that Cura has printing profiles for UM material built in, so you don't have to find optimal settings yourself. These profiles are improving with every release of Cura.

Look up the specs here: https://ultimaker.com/en/products/materials/cpe

 

The PC material I use and have great success with is the Ultimaker PC. It is the strongest and highest temp material I have found yet. I do really like it a lot

[shurik 87]

The PC material I use and have great success with is the Ultimaker PC.

 

How do you make it stick to the glass? And in general, what are the recommended print settings?

[tomnagel 126]

How do you make it stick to the glass? And in general, what are the recommended print settings?

 

For every material there are printing instructions on the UM website, look here for the instructions for PC. These are valid for PC from UM, your mileage for other brands may vary.

PC is tricky. For example, it is easy to pull the chips from your glass plate if you don't follow the instructions.

[kmanstudios 1,120]

 

How do you make it stick to the glass? And in general, what are the recommended print settings?

 

For every material there are printing instructions on the UM website, look here for the instructions for PC. These are valid for PC from UM, your mileage for other brands may vary.

PC is tricky. For example, it is easy to pull the chips from your glass plate if you don't follow the instructions.

 

Definitely. I just used those settings and they worked. I also taped up a bubble wrap barrier to hold in heat.

I have also printed using an exceptionally clean plate (alcohol) and even a PVA slurry to put a slight barrier between it and the glass. I have been trying to get other things done before I return to it so it has been a couple of weeks.

Here is a sample of the weirdness I do:

https://ultimaker.com/en/community/35928-can-the-um3-print-polycarbonate

I brimmed the heck out of it, but, to be fair, I did use a PVA brim just to keep air from the edges.

Again, I re-iterate, I was/am using the Ultimaker PC material. Every other make of materials from other vendors (PLA, Etc) do have different properties in general. So, if not using the Ultimaker PC, consider them a jumping off point.

[tomnagel 126]

Did you follow the advice on the support pages to use a raft?

[kmanstudios 1,120]

Did you follow the advice on the support pages to use a raft?

 

To me? Nope...just winging it a bit with that sort of thing. The slurry I make from recycled PVA can be thick. I was trying to use the PVA as a cradle type of support on one set of experiments, but wow, environmental issues play with that prospect a lot. The black piece with the spikey parts was just on the PVA slurry. I was paying attention to temp (Bed and nozzle) and speeds mostly. I also used a bit of my experience with T-Glase with the bed height (just a tiny bit looser than the normal tightness I would level with and then did not active level as it would have wiped that out) so that it would lay down a nice, hot loop. It really bridged well. I could not believe how clean the arches were in the piece I printed and nice overhangs too.

As soon as I get this project finished (been the tech week from hell and really bad sinus infection the week before) I will be trying to print my supersized Enterprise with it. The only part I will use something different on will be the Red Nacelle Hydrogen Scoops (I will be using a transparent PETG for those). But it is what I am wanting to print it with primarily because of the strength it has. It will be a 39 inch model printed in parts and with those long, tube/angled parts, I do not want a weak plastic. And I have much more success with the PC than ABS.

That stuff is strong! But the PVA slurry did put a nice surface between the glass and the PC material. It was fun to let it sit and cool. I could hear it just cut loose from the PVA on the plate without any damage to the glass.

[kmanstudios 1,120]

Oh and one last thing on that....I followed a piece of advice from (I think) gr5 about letting the buildplate heat up with the heat shield ( my fancy mit der schmancy bubble wrap) to let the ambient temp come up and even out before I started to print.

[shurik 87]

Eventually, I was not that much successful with the PC - the interlayer adhesion was too weak, I easily broke the part in one hand.

On the other side the TitanX turned out great. I like this stuff!

Thanks everyone for your advises.

[kmanstudios 1,120]

Eventually, I was not that much successful with the PC - the interlayer adhesion was too weak, I easily broke the part in one hand.

o_O

Wow, I had a print that I started over after about 10 layers because I noticed that I'd made a mistake and could not tear the part apart. I mean with pliers in both hands twisting and pulling.

And on another print I could bounce it off the floor. the only trouble i had was when I dropped a part and it hit a thin, spindly thing.

I am glad that you found something you like though. That is what counts. But at some point, you should try a different PC. That stuff is strong.

[SyntaxTerror 344]

Eventually, I was not that much successful with the PC - the interlayer adhesion was too weak, I easily broke the part in one hand.

Maybe try ramping up the temperature?

[shurik 87]

I printed at 250C.

Could that be that the filament was too wet from the air moisture? It did have a little bit of air popping up during the nozzle heatup phase but not during the print.

[kmanstudios 1,120]

I printed at 250C.

Could that be that the filament was too wet from the air moisture? It did have a little bit of air popping up during the nozzle heatup phase but not during the print.

I would not know as you were using a different brand. There can be that much difference between brands. Could have been a speed issue too.

I know I slowed my print speeds quite a bit. But the brand difference makes it difficult for me to diagnose.

Maybe you could contact the manufacturer and give them the details and get some good info. I know I would like to hear that myself.

Info is always good to collect.

[SyntaxTerror 344]

You mentioned TitanX from formfutura. Have you checked ApolloX? As I think I've pointed out a few times already on the forum, I'm a big fan of ASA. I've nothing but good experiences with it - it's quite easy to print, tough as nails, UV resistant and does indeed give a very nice texture. As for the heat resistance it's comparable to TitanX. Actually vicat softening is one degree higher (98 degrees C).

[shurik 87]

Have you checked ApolloX?

Yes. I had a chat with Formfutura representative (who was not really helpful beside citing the specs docs).

I went for TitanX as it has much greater impact strength (58KJ/m2 vs. 18KJ/m2 of ApolloX) and is almost as strong in tensile one (43.6 MPa vs. 47.5MPa of ApolloX).

Overall, I like this stuff. It is easy to print, nice surface finish, good layer adhesion, has some typical ABS odor, albeit much less than classical ABS.

[kmanstudios 1,120]

Have you checked ApolloX?

Yes. I had a chat with Formfutura representative (who was not really helpful beside citing the specs docs).

I went for TitanX as it has much greater impact strength (58KJ/m2 vs. 18KJ/m2 of ApolloX) and is almost as strong in tensile one (43.6 MPa vs. 47.5MPa of ApolloX).

Overall, I like this stuff. It is easy to print, nice surface finish, good layer adhesion, has some typical ABS odor, albeit much less than classical ABS.

Is it an ABS derivative? Or, maybe a better way to put it, a form of ABS.

I really should just google it, but I am on my way out for an appointment and I gotta prettyfy myself and that is a major effort.

[SyntaxTerror 344]

Is it an ABS derivative? Or, maybe a better way to put it, a form of ABS.

I really should just google it, but I am on my way out for an appointment and I gotta prettyfy myself and that is a major effort.

1) Yes, TitanX is some sort of modified ABS.

2) LMAO.

[SyntaxTerror 344]

Have you checked ApolloX?

Yes. I had a chat with Formfutura representative (who was not really helpful beside citing the specs docs).

I went for TitanX as it has much greater impact strength (58KJ/m2 vs. 18KJ/m2 of ApolloX) and is almost as strong in tensile one (43.6 MPa vs. 47.5MPa of ApolloX).

Overall, I like this stuff. It is easy to print, nice surface finish, good layer adhesion, has some typical ABS odor, albeit much less than classical ABS.

Indeed, if the TDS is anything to go by, TitanX is just off the damn charts in impact strength - it's almost twice(!) normal ABS which is pretty damn impact resistant to begin with. So if that's what you need, TitanX is obviously something to be tried.

[kmanstudios 1,120]

Is it an ABS derivative? Or, maybe a better way to put it, a form of ABS.

I really should just google it, but I am on my way out for an appointment and I gotta prettyfy myself and that is a major effort.

1) Yes, TitanX is some sort of modified ABS.

2) LMAO.

Thanks for the quick info. Just got back and it is nice to have one thing I do not have to do while I am solving modeling/printing problems/philosophies.

It can now be filed away in the attic of me mind and I can focus on something else and not forget.

We really need a 'thumbs up' emoticon. So, you get a heart instead <3

Edited May 16, 2017 by Guest

[SyntaxTerror 344]

I can do one better for you: TDS

[kmanstudios 1,120]

I can do one better for you: TDS

Doooooddddd

Thanks!! I will have to look into that as I have 3 spools of ABS that I do not know what I will do with it. I have better successes with the oddball stuff like PC/Flex/Semi-Flex than I do ABS.

I have gotten more knowledgeable, but I also find it to be brittle. But, I need to return to that once I finish my current projects.

Been stuck on making the best possible options for printing the 14" Enterprise and sometimes, it just takes a while to test options.

Thanks again!!

Edited May 16, 2017 by Guest