How do I get started?

[jaysenodell 17]

So you guys are saying that it's not normal to have 538hr of print time on a printer I took out of the box Dec 12, 2023? 

[champsteve778 1]

If the planter is too advanced, here is a smaller one

 

I tried to print with same settings I used for the planter and the same thing happened as did to my planter that I showed you in the video. As in a messy start.

 

Thanks in advance,

 

Steve

CE3E3V2_roman-small-cup.3mf

Edited June 19 by champsteve778

[GregValiant 1,318]

I use the ends of filament rolls for practice for things like pausing and testing post-processors.  I decided to print the 75% model to keep junk in.

At this point it has about 70 layers to go.  This is "Spiralized" so it is a single wall at 0.60 Line Width.

 

 

Prints that require very specific support can be difficult.  A print like this is just a print and once you get the bed adhesion figured out it will print well.

[champsteve778 1]

I'm confused how did you get my planter to work? Just follow which your file/directions or slashees file/directions?

 

Also you guys said it was too advanced. So I moved to the small roman cup attached. When I tried to print the cup same thing happened last time I tried my planter in the video.

 

I'm confused even more... how does the "4 point bed leveling path.gcode" work (can you explain like you are talking to a fourth grader? Like what does chase the nozzle mean? Also I thought I should be heating the hot end to 200) and then how should I print my "cup / planter" right after?... I don't have an automatic bed leveler btw. Does it actually level everything on its own so I don't got to fiddle with the 4 knobs and paper? Also when you say "I think you will find it easier than fiddling with the knob"... what knob are you talking about? Should I be changing the temp to 200 after printing? I just need some confirmaiton on this.

 

Also what does printing spiralized mean?

 

Talk Soon,

 

Steve

Edited June 19 by champsteve778

[GregValiant 1,318]

In "vase" mode (called "Spiralize Outer Contour" in Cura) only the external shell of a model is printed.  The model must be solid thru-and-thru because extra structure interferes.  The pine planter is solid, it doesn't need any supports (which also interfere) and so is a suitable model to spiralize.  There is never a top surface in a spiralized print.

 

The base layers are printed in normal fashion, and you can set the number of bottom layers.  Once the nozzle finishes the bottom layers, it starts a single continuous path up the model.  Rather than finishing a layer, moving to the start, and extruding the next layer....the path just keeps going with incremental Z moves as it goes.  It's a helical path and there aren't any Z-seams because there are no stops or starts at any layer change.  It just keeps going.

 

One of the keys to this hobby is getting the first layer to stick to the bed.  People refer to it as "leveling" but you are really setting the Initial Z height.  If you told Cura to put down a 0.20 initial layer, but after "leveling" the gap is really 0.30, then you will be under-extruded by 50% and the extrusion will just pull around behind the nozzle like a rubber-band instead of staying where it was put.

There is a way to cheat.  In the "Material" settings is "Initial Layer Flow".  If you set that to something like 110% then Cura will plan for more plastic in the first layer and it can be enough to make up for the too-high leveling.  When your leveling gets more consistent and closer to correct you can back off on that Initial Layer Flow.  For right now it's fine and will help get rid of the frustration of having to abort prints because they aren't sticking.

 

[Slashee_the_Cow 351]

2 hours ago, champsteve778 said:

I'm confused how did you get my planter to work? Just follow which your file/directions or slashees file/directions?

Since I'm 99% sure Greg has an Ender-3 (or V2, or both) I'm assuming he just sliced his project file, put the gcode file onto a memory card, stuck it in the printer and started it printing as normal.

 

2 hours ago, champsteve778 said:

I'm confused even more... how does the "4 point bed leveling path.gcode" work (can you explain like you are talking to a fourth grader? Like what does chase the nozzle mean?

1. Gcode heats the hot end to 150° and bed to 50°.
2. Printer beeps so you know it's ready.
3. Printer head moves to left front corner and starts moving down to Z0. Make sure to stick your paper in there before it gets to the bottom (the "chasing" he's referring to)
4. Once the nozzle stops going down, it waits 10 seconds so you can adjust the knob to get it to the right height, and in my experience "the right height" is when you can move your paper around a bit but there's a bit of resistance and you can feel it dragging against the nozzle a little
5. After ten seconds the print head moves back up and starts moving to the next corner (so "chase" it with your paper)
6. Repeat steps 3-5 for left rear corner, right rear corner then right front corner

 

2 hours ago, champsteve778 said:

Also I thought I should be heating the hot end to 200) and then how should I print my "cup / planter" right after?

The hot end needs to be 200° for printing, but the gcode for the "cup/planter" will handle that for you. It's lower for the levelling path because the bed and nozzle will change a little bit when they heat up (they're metal, and metal expands when it gets hotter). It's a bit lower than what you should be printing at just to make it harder to burn yourself (I assume).

 

After that just print your "cup/planter" the normal way, go to the print menu on the printer's screen and select it.

[champsteve778 1]

I get this:

 

Quote

Since I'm 99% sure Greg has an Ender-3 (or V2, or both) I'm assuming he just sliced his project file, put the gcode file onto a memory card, stuck it in the printer and started it printing as normal.

 

so I just load in "4 point bed leveling path.gcode" into my ender...  follow your directions (1 to 6) and once it finishes load gregs sliced "GV_Pine Spiralized" into my ender 3... then and everything is good to go? how about setting "initial layer flow" and setting "Spiralize Outer Contour"

 

can you do one for my cup as well? or is it the same?

 

also, so gregs sliced "GV_Pine Spiralized" will change the temp to 200?

 

both are good models eh?

Edited June 20 by champsteve778

[GregValiant 1,318]

The Little Roman Cup can't be spiralized because one edge is lower than the other.  From the point where the toolpath stops being a circle and becomes an arc the Spiral effect will fail.  It's just the way it works.

 

Open that project file I posted "As a Project".

Set Cura up so you are in the Custom settings so the advanced view is on screen.

Next to the Setting Search Box is an icon with three lines.  It is the setting visibility tool.  Set the visibility to All.

Go to the Material Settings and find "Initial Layer Flow" and set it to 110 or 112%.

Go to the Quality Settings and set the Line Width to 0.60.  It will be fine with a 0.4 nozzle and the print will be much stronger.

Slice the project and save the gcode.

Make sure the print surface is clean.  Wiping it down with Isopropyl Alcohol is a good idea.  No fingerprints.

 

You should have the two gcode files on the SD card.  The "4 point leveling" file and the Gcode of the pine cone thing.

Get your piece of paper ready and print the Leveling file.  Chase the nozzle with the paper so that every time the nozzle comes down to bed height it rests on the paper.  Adjust the relevant knob till you just feel a scratch on the paper.

 

When that leveling routine is done then cross your fingers and print the real model.  It will have it's own temperature controls and will take over the entire process.

 

If it drags the filament around again then abort, clean up, and start over.  This time allow more pressure on the paper when you level.  You don't want it trapped by the nozzle as there must be enough room for the plastic to extrude.

It's like the age old question "How do I get to Carnegie Hall?" > "Practice, practice, practice".

 

 

[GregValiant 1,318]

I forgot...

Like Slashee says, that leveling file doesn't do any extruding so the parts don't need to be at operating temperature where they might drool.  Just getting them good and warmed up will allow much of the expansion to take place and so the leveling process will be more accurate.

[champsteve778 1]

alright it worked!! what is my next step? I might print 4 - 6 of these each with a different colour. Is that a good idea? or should I make it bigger and stronger?

 

 

Edited June 20 by champsteve778

[Slashee_the_Cow 351]

1 hour ago, champsteve778 said:

alright it worked!! what is my next step? I might print 4 - 6 of these each with a different colour. Is that a good idea? or should I make it bigger and stronger?

Well... do you want 4-6 in other colours (practice to make sure you've got the process right never hurts) or do you want a bigger, stronger one? Bigger is easy (just scale it in Cura) but stronger is a bit more complex (you can't make it any stronger if it's spiralised, so you'd have to make a hollowed out version like I did).

[GregValiant 1,318]

It's huge that you got it to stick to the bed.  Now all you have to do is decide what you want / need.

Thingiverse has lots of stuff you can download.  You can print parts to bling the printer, or make custom gizmos for things around the house, whatever.

Learning some sort of CAD system and designing your own things is a lot more satisfying than printing someone else's design.

I would advise you work your way slowly into more complex pieces that require a lot of support.  Supports are a necessary part of FDM printing but they are a pain to get right in the slice (almost always involves compromises) and to remove.

 

You will want to know how to use "Support Blockers" which really come in handy.

Supports in tight spots can be tough to remove.  Some of the tools you will want to get would include:

A hobby knife, needle nose pliers, a set of "picks", a set of micro files.  Those things are available at hardware stores.

 

 

I designed the "GV_SupportShape" model as a test for trying out different support types. 

GV_SupportShape.stl

 

This one is just a weird shape with different radii and corners.  It can help tune things like Acceleration, Jerk, and Speed.

GV_CalibrationShape.stl

 

Remember that you can scale them up or down.  If you completely ignore them and go a different way that's OK too.

[champsteve778 1]

36 minutes ago, GregValiant said:

It's huge that you got it to stick to the bed.  Now all you have to do is decide what you want / need.

 

I actually used some all purpose glue stick.

 

37 minutes ago, GregValiant said:

Remember that you can scale them up or down.  If you completely ignore them and go a different way that's OK too.

 

I will keep this in mind.

 

Talk Soon,

 

Steve

[Slashee_the_Cow 351]

3 minutes ago, champsteve778 said:

I actually used some all purpose glue stick.

In that case, definitely don't forget to wipe your print bed down with some isopropyl alcohol to get rid of any residue.

[champsteve778 1]

6 hours ago, Slashee_the_Cow said:

Bigger is easy (just scale it in Cura)

 

I may want to make it bigger... So all I got to do is load GVs 3mf of the planter/vase, then make the edits he said... then scale the model to desired point... then slice? Then move onto the printing? I don't have to change any settings, correct?

 

[Slashee_the_Cow 351]

37 minutes ago, champsteve778 said:

I may want to make it bigger... So all I got to do is load GVs 3mf of the planter/vase, then make the edits he said... then scale the model to desired point... then slice? Then move onto the printing? I don't have to change any settings, correct?

Correct.

[champsteve778 1]

new problem... see picture: (it is leaving openings)... anyone know the problem?

 

[champsteve778 1]

now look at it

 

[GregValiant 1,318]

The hot ends that come with the Ender 3 and Ender 3 Pro suffer from problems.  I don't know if the design changed in later models.  I ended up replacing my hot end (Ender 3 Pro about 4 years old) with an aftermarket "all-metal" hot end.  It isn't perfect, but it's much better than the stock unit was.  I replaced it about 2 months after I got the printer because the constant under-extrusion problems were driving me nuts.

 

The intermittent under-extrusion can have a few causes.  These are popular ones.

• The pressure arms of the early plastic extruders on the Ender models were subject to cracking at the pivot hole.  You might have to remove it to inspect it.  The failure rate for those plastic pressure arms was 100%.  Some machines were actually delivered with broken pressure arms.  Amazing.
• If the hot end fan isn't doing it's job correctly (dust and strings on the blades or a blocked air path or a blade missing) then heat can move up through the heat break and into the heat exchanger and the filament starts to soften up high where it should not.  That creates a condition where the filament isn't being pushed out as it should be.
• Overly long retractions (in excess of about 7.5mm) can draw molten plastic up into the heat break and it cools a bit creating a partial blockage.
• The bowden tube design requires that the end of the bowden is cut exactly square so that it mates flush with the back end of the nozzle.  That creates a seal.  The fitting that holds the bowden in place in both the hot end and in the extruder have small blades that cut into the bowden tube to hold it.  Constant retractions cause the tube to push-and-pull causing the little knives to cut deeper and allowing the tube to shuffle in and out of the fittings. The movement of the print head along the X axis causes the bowden tube to rotate in the fitting.  Those allow the end of the bowden to pull away from the nozzle leaving a gap and once again, molten plastic can be drawn in creating a little o-ring that impedes the filament movement down into the nozzle.
• Some filament can char in the hot end.  When little pieces of char break off they can cause a partial blockage of the nozzle.  After a little bit of time, the piece of char can clear and the nozzle starts extruding properly again until the next piece of char breaks free and the cycle repeats itself.  This failure mode is usually easy to spot because you will see black flecks in the print.

When the extruder struggles to push the filament the extruder will "jump back" which is referred to as "skipping steps".  It is characterized by a clicking sound from the extruder.  You should hear it if it is doing that.

You will need to disassemble the hot end and clean it out.  It needs to be warmed up when you do that so be careful.  I have a piece of coat hanger that is just the right diameter to push any softened plastic out of the hot end.

A single edge safety razor is a good tool to trim the bowden.  Trimming is normal maintenance and is the reason bowden tubes are considered "consumables".  I have a piece of brass tubing that the bowden will just slide into.  The end of the brass is a square cut and it makes a nice guide for the razor blade when I trim the tube.  Trimming 5 or 6 mm off the tube is sufficient.  You want to get past the teeth marks left by the fittings.

 

This next is a really odd one but has happened to me.

The amount of pressure that the pressure arm exerts is adjustable using the screw next to where the bowden tube exits the extruder.  If the pressure is too high it can deform the filament to a point where it no longer wants to pass through the bowden tube easily.  This is characterized by an "accordion" look to the filament when you pull it back out of the printer.

 

There.  Now you have something to do tomorrow.

 

[champsteve778 1]

whoa man you really know your stuff!

 

so you are saying I should replace the nozzle with an all metal one?

 

does it have anything to do with the filament?

 

 

 

 

[Slashee_the_Cow 351]

7 minutes ago, champsteve778 said:

so you are saying I should replace the nozzle with an all metal one?

He's talking about the hot end. It's the bit the nozzle screws into which actually heats the filament. Creality have a reputation for using whatever parts they could find to put together their printers instead of exactly the same parts in all builds of a certain model, so some have less-than-ideal parts in them.

(The nozzle should be all metal anyway, most printers come with brass nozzles, but you can also buy stainless steel and probably others.)

 

12 minutes ago, champsteve778 said:

does it have anything to do with the filament?

It could. Filament comes in a wide array of qualities, from "works good every time" to "it literally it killed my printer" (that second one has happened to me twice). I've found a brand that works great (eSun PLA+ FWIW) so I just buy that. The variegated colour (colour changes as it goes along and "silky" filaments can be a bit harder to print with, so if in doubt, just use a plain colour of regular PLA.

 

Also: check to make sure the spool is properly wound. One spool I got (from a different brand) after about the first third of the spool the filament was getting tangled up under itself so the extruder had to pull extra hard in order to get it out, which resulted in underextrusion. Not usually a problem but it can happen (more likely with cheaper brands). I ended up printing a spool stand and manually pulled the filament off the spool and fed it through a tube into the printer's tent because I can't really afford to waste things. Also that spool had a knot in it. I still have no %(#*ing idea how that happens. Fortunately because I was manually unwinding it I noticed it and manually cut off the filament around it, then when the printer was nearly up to the cut end I paused the print, pulled out that little bit and put the post-knot filament in.

[champsteve778 1]

yeah it may be dried filament in the nozzle area... I took a pin device and cleared it... fingers crossed

[Slashee_the_Cow 351]

26 minutes ago, champsteve778 said:

yeah it may be dried filament in the nozzle area... I took a pin device and cleared it... fingers crossed

You can specialised nozzle cleaners - not expensive at all - which are generally a very thin bit of flexible metal ~6cm long (at least the ones I've got) with a bit of a handle below. But a pin is a good start 🙂

 

Unfortunately not included is depth perception. I'm guessing sticking a very thin bit of metal into a slightly wider bit of metal is a lot easier if you can tell where the two are relative to each other in 3D space.

[GregValiant 1,318]

Thanks Slashee, I forgot about the "tangled spool" syndrome.

 

I read this someplace and I believe it...

"There are three places for the end of the filament:  1) In the extruder. 2) In your hand. 3) In the little hole in the side of the spool."