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Miykoll

Drift and Under Extrusion with UM2

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Hello community,

I got drift and under extrusion with the UM2 . The drift started yesterday and started with larger parts, but now also with smaller parts (sizes of 1/3 of the print bed).

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I just noticed the under extrusion and created a test file (test_square) to see the drifting and under extrusion. The pictures say enough. I got drift in both X and Y. I search the forum for drift and placed marks on the pulleys to see if they slip. However this did not occur. I did not extra tighten the pulleys, maybe I'm going to do that just for sake of completeness.

test_square.thumb.PNG.7f3bc62aadc8c880aa3ffec5dcbfb0a0.PNG

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Another point is lubrication, unfortunately I cannot test it now since I do not have lubrication at hand.

Furthermore, the filament is sometimes retracted a lit bit, rotating the feeder actuator. I think that's because the filament roll is getting smaller, so the feeder requires more torque to overcome the friction force of the filament roll. No slip occurs, the feeder is just rotated backwards. Have anyone seen this before?

photo5855237475239307751.thumb.jpg.24bb5c61924ddff04c0e4e5db73ea6ed.jpg

I hope it is a bit clear what my problems are and that the pictures are sufficient enough. Just request for more information if it is not the case.

- Michael

To reduce the size of the post, I placed the images into an album, only have no clue how to include an album in here or refer to it by URL. So all the images are included in the post.

Edit: A video of another design where the drift occurs around 0:26. You can hear it jamming.

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3D_drift_3.thumb.jpg.e6f5a63f7f1ce0cad6cf56d0b79ace2c.jpg

test_square.thumb.PNG.7f3bc62aadc8c880aa3ffec5dcbfb0a0.PNG

photo5855237475239307753.thumb.jpg.0c383be0a92d31c6ad8871b7eaf4e26b.jpg

photo5855237475239307750.thumb.jpg.8e3802169e5866cc609966de73dc7694.jpg

photo5855237475239307751.thumb.jpg.24bb5c61924ddff04c0e4e5db73ea6ed.jpg

Edited by Guest

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This is a common problem. The set screws inside the pulleys are not tight enough. Tighten the hell out of them. All 11. If you only found 8 you didn't tighten the most likely culprits - those on the motors and short belts.

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Thanks you for the response.

This solves the drift, but is under extrusion also common with this problem, or might this be a temperature / speed problem?

As you can see my speed is not that high, temp. is 210 C and using green Makerpoint

PLA for 180-210 C

Edited by Guest

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Sounds like you are doing 60mm at .1mm layer height and 210C temp on UM2.

Well that should be fine. I wouldn't go any faster. Actually I think the quality might be better at 30mm and .2mm layer height but that's not your issue so let's forget about that.

Here's my standard underextrusion notes pasted in for you but I'd look seriously at #3 and ignore #1. And I'm happy with my black feeder but consider getting a medusa upgrade or the "plus" kit. But you can fix this without upgrading your extruder.

CAUSES FOR UNDEREXTRUSION AND HOW TO TEST FOR THEM AND REMEDY THEM

As far as underextrusion causes - there's just so damn many. none of the issues seem to cause more than 20% of problems so you need to know the top 5 issues to cover 75% of the possibilities and 1/4 people still won't have the right issue. Some of the top issues:

1) Print slower and hotter! Here are top recommended speeds for .2mm layers (twice as fast for .1mm layers) and .4mm nozzle:

20mm/sec at 200C

30mm/sec at 210C

40mm/sec at 225C

50mm/sec at 240C

The printer can do double these speeds but with huge difficulty and usually with a loss in part quality due to underextrusion. Different colors print best at quite different temperatures and due to imperfect temp sensors, some printers print 10C cool so use these values as an initial starting guideline and if you are still underextruding try raising the temp. But don't go over 240C with PLA.

2) Shell width confusion. Shell width must be a multiple of nozzle size. For example if nozzle size is .4mm and shell width is 1mm cura will make the printer do 2 passes with .5mm line width which is possible but requires you to slow down much more to make a .5mm line out of a .4mm nozzle. If you really want this then set nozzle size to .5mm so it's clear what you are asking Cura to do for you.

3) Isolator - this is most common if you've printed extra hot (>240C) for a few hours or regular temps (220C) for 500 hours. It gets soft and compresses the filament under pressure. It's the white part touching the heater block. It's very hard to test when not under full pressure (spring and bowden) so sometimes it's best to just replace it. Also if you notice parts of it are very soft (the blacker end where it touches higher heat) then it's too old and needs replacing.

4) Curved filament at end of spool - if you are past half way on spool, try a fresh spool as a test.

5) curved angle feeding into feeder - put the filament on the floor -makes a MASSIVE difference.

6) Head too tight? Bizarrely MANY people loosen the 4 screws on the head by just a bit maybe 1/2 mm and suddenly they can print just fine! Has to do with pressure on the white teflon isolator.

6b) Bowden pushing too hard - for the same reason you don't want the bowden pushing too hard on the isolator.

6c) Spring pushing too hard. Although you want a gap you want as small as possible a gap between teflon isolator and steel isolator nut such that the spring is compressed as little as possible.

7) clogged nozzle - the number one problem of course - even if it seems clear. There can be build up on the inside of the nozzle that only burning with a flame can turn to ash and remove. Sometimes a grain of sand gets in there but that's more obvious (it just won't print). Atomic method (cold pull) helps but occasionally you need to remove the entire heater block/nozzle assembly and use flame. Or soak it in acetone overnight (after removing 90% of the material with cold pull).

8) Temp Sensor bad - even the good ones vary by +/- 5C and bad ones can be any amount off - they usually read high and a working sensor can (rarely) fail high slowly over time. Meaning the sensor thinks you are at 220C but actually you are at 170C. At 170C the plastic is so viscous it can barely get out of the nozzle. You can verify your temp sensor using this simple video at youtube - on you tube search for this: mrZbX-SfftU

9) feeder spring issues - too tight, too loose

10) Other feeder issues, one of the nuts holding machine together often interferes with the feeder motor tilting it enough so that it still works but not very well. Other things that tilt the feeder motor, sleeve misaligned so it doesn't get a good grip. Gunk clogging the mechanism in there.

11) Filament diameter too big - 3mm is too much. 3mm filament is usually 2.85mm nominal or sometimes 2.9mm +/- .05. But some manufacturers (especially in china) make true 3.0mm filament with a tolerance of .1mm which is useless in an Ultimaker. It will print for a few meters and then clog so tight in the bowden you will have to remove the bowden from both ends to get the filament out. Throw that filament in the trash! It will save you weeks of pain

11b) Something wedged in with the filament. I was setting up 5 printers at once and ran filament change on all of them. One was slowly moving the filament through the tube and was almost to the head when I pushed the button and it sped up and ground the filament badly. I didn't think it was a problem and went ahead and printed something but there was a ground up spot followed by a flap of filament that got jammed in the bowden tube. Having the "plus" upgrade or using the IRobertI feeder helps you feel this with your hand by sliding the filament through the bowden a bit to see if it is stuck.

12) Hot weather. If air is above 30C or even possibly 25C, the air temperature combined with the extruder temperature can soften the filament inside the feeder such that it is getting squeezed flat as it passes through the feeder - this is obvious as you can see the problem in the bowden. The fix is to add a desk fan blowing on the back of the printer. Not an issue on the UM2 "plus" series.

13) Crimped bowden. At least one person had an issue where the bowden was crimped a bit too much at the feeder and although the printer worked fine when new it eventually got worse and had underextrusion on random layers. it's easy to pull the bowden out of the feeder end and examine it.

14) Small nozzle. Rumor has it some of the .4mm nozzles are closer to .35mm. Not sure if this is actually true. I'm a bit skeptical but try a .6mm nozzle maybe.

15) CF filament. The knurled sleeve in the extruder can get ground down smooth - particularly from carbon fill. 4 spools of CF will destroy not just nozzles but the knurled sleeve also. Look at it visually where the filament touches the "pyramids". Make sure the pyramids are sharp.

16) Hot feeder driver. I've seen a more recent problem in the forums (>=2015) where people's stepper drivers get too hot - this is mostly a problem with the Z axis but also with the feeder. The high temps means the driver appears to shut down for a well under a second - maybe there is a temp sensor built into the driver chip? The solution from Ultimaker is that they lowered all the currents to their stepper drivers in the newer firmware. Another solution is to remove the cover and use desk fan to get a tiny bit of air movement under there. TinkerMarlin lets you set the currents from the menu system or you can send a gcode to lower the current. Ultimaker lowered the default currents in July of 2015 from 1300ma to 1200ma for X,Y,Z but left extruder at 1250. Other people (I think the support team of a major reseller but I forget) recommend X,Y,Z go down to 1000mA.

M907 E1250

Above sets the extruder max current to the default - 1250mA. So try 900mA. This will only change until next power cycle so if you like your new value and want to save it use M500. You can just put these into an otherwise empty gcode file and "print" this and it will change. Or get tinkergnome marlin! You will wonder how you lived without it: https://github.com/TinkerGnome/Ultimaker2Marlin/releases

M907 E900

M500

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