FatIRobertI feeder for Bondtech dualdrive 1.75mm cheap kit

[neotko 1,406]

Fat’IRobertI’ Feeder for Bondtech 1.75 Kit

https://www.youmagine.com/designs/fat-iroberti-feeder-for-bondtech-dualdrive-1-75mm

First of all BIG thanks to @IRobertI without his original files I would not be able to pull this feeder in so little time.

This upgrade it’s for users who want something more reliable than a MK7 for their 1.75 filaments.

Almost a year ago I modded my machines to 1.75 and found out that the MK7’s by reprapworld where quite good, in fact I been using them for almost 8 months without much issues. The think it’s that two of them started to loose their grip, bough more from them and they where even worse. So I started looking for new, and hopefully, better gears.

I was very interested on the bondtech gears since they release them, but until not so long ago, they only had the full kit, they sell for 140 or so euros, and for me that I have 3 machines it was quite the investment. So I bough x3 of the Dualdrive gears diy kits that go for 40€ each and thanks to IRobertI I was able to put my dirty hands on his amazing design for the IRobertI feeder. My goal, adapt it to use this cheap kit so I could have cheaper and more reliable extruder bolts.

Test done so far:

Around 15h (on one printer) with the pre-final version and so far 25h of prints (in total on 3 printers) without issues and perfect prints. No squished filament, no grinding, and zero issues.

Done many prints with tons of retractions in a very short period of time and the filament come out perfect.

Print it!

Remember that the ‘Latch’ from IRobertI feeder isn’t included as I didn’t modified it. Download it from his super design at https://www.youmagine.com/designs/alternative-um2-feeder-version-two#documents

I always print this kind of stuff at 50-70mm/s 0.2 layer height, fans at layer 3-6 and full fans before the more conflictive areas, for 0.2 layer that should be around layer 30-ish. 25% infill, 3 perimeters (or 1.2mm for cura & 0.4 nozzle). Supports active (sorry guys I use S3D for the supports, so I didn’t design supports for this). For S3D if you set Support Pillars Resolution to 6,00mm it won’t generate supports on inner areas that don’t need it.

Install it

STEP 1

Cut a small piece of Bowden tube (better from unused ones) and insert it on area for it (see photo).

STEP 2

For UMO/UMO+ use my adapter holder. If not, well you are alone on this since I only have umo+ (it should fit perfectly on a um2 as far as I know but I really can’t be sure).

Insert the bondtech dualdrive that has the hex very little screw (it’s so small, don’t loose it on the ground!) and place it, no need to place it perfectly, but you need to install it before the next steps.

STEP 3

Place a M3 nut on the FatIRobertI Arm, and insert a m3 screw until you make the nut fully in. Then take out the screw used to help do this.

Insert the IRobertI “Feeder V6 Latch” on the FatIRobertI.

Insert the FatIRobertI Arm.

Place the FatIRobertI Top & screw it to the motor with x4 M3 30mm screws to secure everything. Then you will need to adjust the dualdrive bolt so it’s perfectly on it’s position. Too low and it will grind the plastic, too high and it will create a number of problems. So check it and double check it.

STEP 4

The FatIRobertI Hands, only have one correct position. The curved area must be facing ‘up’ on the direction of the extrusion.

Insert the Hands on the Arm and while doing that they will ‘open’. Use this time to install the Mirror Bondtech part, that goes with needle bearings on a 3mm little 20mm metal ‘thingy’.

Once in, press both sides so the mirror gear it’s fit, don’t overdo-it, and fell with your hands that it actually spins free.

STEP 5. Done!

Insert the white thingy that clips the bowden, insert it, and clip it with the blue ring, and done.

Number of esteps that Bondtech recommends it’s 141.0, IMO 141.2 it’s more accurate.

Final notes

I have not tested this with any flexible filament, it's one of my to-do-be-do-be-do's but so far with one of problematic filaments 'Pla-tec' everything has worked flawlessly.

Great job @Bondtech for this drive gears, but It would be nice to actually have a basic design, or at least the measures of the bolt so other users can do their feeders. After doing 7 designs until I got it right I get that the feeder must be properly designed and printed for it to work, but also it isn’t that hard and saving money it’s always nice if works.

This feeder could be used with the fantastic @Meduza gear upgrade box, it would just need longer M3 screws (probably 35-40mm). I don’t plan to do this just because I don’t find necessary to push filament that ‘hard’ and I prefer to not over-force the filament and get a better flow control without weird blobs caused by extruding with too much pressure at cold temps. Every filament has it’s temps, and forcing filament (at least for me) doesn’t help to get better prints.

I might test their geared solution soon with the @Gudo PIB Coupler. But that's another history...

Update 3 Nov 2016

Added a Bottom part for 4mm OD 2mm ID Bowdens. It should work with @meduza clip

Edited November 3, 2016 by Guest

[gudo 246]

Great job Neotko !

[neotko 1,406]

Willowflex printing great!

No issues, this it's my last test printing some foots for my 3 printers. This photos are around 200-300 retractions of 2.5mm at maximum speed (recommend by the filament maker). So far amazing!!

Print speed it's 45mm/s constant but I did some other stuff at 50-55 and the prints are superb.

The only problem I see with this filament it's that it needs high fans but also it doesn't stick well to glass with hairspray (seller recommends bluetape but I don't have atm). Anyhow, great!

[neotko 1,406]

This it's so awesome

 

And finish!

 

Edited August 6, 2016 by Guest

[Kevparang 10]

Do you use Aquanet?

[neotko 1,406]

Flexible materials on Bowden? Fyeah!

 

Smartflex 93A Shore A 45mm/s 235C 0.2 layer Retractions 2.5mm ON (but cut down to a minimum and playing also with combing/wipe for better quality) around 40 retractions in total

[neotko 1,406]

Final test: 40mm/s 255C (testing on the second machine)

[nerdwarrior 18]

Great design, and amazing writeup!

Now I'm convinced to get two of these and hook them up to a y-splitter leading into an E3D V6.

I just have a quick question, though: what are the dimensions of the bowden coupling? I don't know where to get one......

[nerdwarrior 18]

Would this one from E3D work?

http://e3d-online.com/Mechanical/Bowden/Threaded-Bowden-Coupling-1.75mm-Filament

[neotko 1,406]

I made it for the 6-2mm bowden tube I use. It should be possible to remodel the stl to fit a 2-4mm but I don't use that.

[nerdwarrior 18]

6-2mm? Wow. Where in the world did u get that?

So basically the one that the UMO+ had originally would fit if I get my hands on a 6-2mm tube?

[neotko 1,406]

My 6mm/2mm bowdens I got them from http://www.charlies3dt.com/ but also https://reprapworld.com has them and on aliexpress I found a very bad seller (they sell the worse stuff but their bowdens are quite ok, at http://www.aliexpress.com/item/32301282980/32301282980.html

In my experience reprapworld bowdens where a bit disappointing, having a inner 1.95-1.98 and a OD of 5.95. Isn't biggie but it means you need bigger (taller) bowden clips like the ones Anders uploaded to youmagine at https://www.youmagine.com/designs/ultimaker-bowden-clip-thicker-version

The ones from china where a bit offcenter, but since I bought 4m I was able to pick 3 pieces that indeed where ok.

The one never failed so far are the ones from charlies3dt.

[neotko 1,406]

Also aince I installed this upgrade I have been printing on 3 printers with it, no errors so far and with the correct tension (pla not too much, not too little) I didn't had any issue so far. This @Bondtech gears are quite impressive at moving (not grinding) any kind of filament.

[nerdwarrior 18]

Woah, that is a nice store! I need to spend some time exploring

I do have one issue with that though:

I want to use this y-splitter: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1680034 but it needs PC4-M5 fittings, and I'm too lazy to modify anything, so I'm hoping to find something like a PC6-M5, which probably doesn't exist. I did find this: http://www.charlies3dt.com/en/product/straight-threaded-push-fit-connectors-1 but it says its a 1/4" thread, and I just get lost when things are put in imperial......

Would that work?

Or will I need to start modifying models?

[nerdwarrior 18]

Okay never mind.

I just remembered that the E3D V6 has the embedded bowden coupling that takes a 4mm OD tube, so yeah, I'll probably need to modify the feeder.

Also, I know this is kind of off topic, but do you think that the y-splitter is worth it? The video they have shows a bit of color contamination, so I'm kind of worried that it might be more trouble than it's worth.

[neotko 1,406]

I suppose it will need a lot of calibration for each kind of color and depending on how large is the hotzone you will need a large/small prime tower to purge for good. Ofc also it might need the Socket e3d sells to avoid nozzle/color contamination or a fixed point wipe?

[nerdwarrior 18]

Socket? Like the blue "socks"?

I'm not sure if that would help, because all they say about it is that it helps retain heat so better bridging and a more stable temp., and any leaked material is blocked.

And yeah, dual extrusion just seems to be so much trouble......

I like your magnetic head changer, but I really want to use the E3D V6 and I don't want to sacrifice any build volume, so......

Yeah. You kind of get where I am. Caught between soluble supports, affordability, and ease of use.

[nerdwarrior 18]

Um hello,

I just measured out the holes, and one side has an opening about 4 mm and the other side has something more like 7 mm (I don't remember the exact numbers, but it was something like that). Why is that?

[neotko 1,406]

Um hello,

I just measured out the holes, and one side has an opening about 4 mm and the other side has something more like 7 mm (I don't remember the exact numbers, but it was something like that). Why is that?

 

What holes? Photo?

[nerdwarrior 18]

What holes? Photo?

 

Sorry I was just looking at the model (not printed). I'm referring to the ones in the "main body" file into which the cut bowden tubes are inserted.

[neotko 1,406]

This?

https://d3v5bfco3dani2.cloudfront.net/photo/image/700x0/57a4e155b2e6f/step1.JPG

So you ask why the bowden doesn't go in more? Or why the bottom is only X size and thr top X size? All bowden used is 6mm/2mm there's no 4mm (or you mean length?)

[nerdwarrior 18]

Yes that part.

Sorry if I was unclear; I meant the hole diameter. I might've measured wrong, but I believe that one hole has a diameter of about 4 mm and the other one is about 7 mm, and I was just wondering why they are like that. Is it other parts, getting a tight fit, etc.?

[neotko 1,406]

The bottom is 4mm to make it easier to insert the filament. Also is a good idea to chamfer the ptfe inside near the input. The hole of the top is 7mm because that's the size needed to fiz the bowden with the white plastic that goes there clamping the bowden.

https://www.youmagine.com/images/146399/download/span4

If you see the stl the hole goes smaller inside to make the bowden fit nice and well.

Edited October 31, 2016 by Guest

[nerdwarrior 18]

Ah I see now. The width of the gap from the top is still 6.5 mm so the bowden tube will fit nicely

And now that you've said that, the pieces of the puzzle are finally coming together, and I'm surprised at how much thought you've put into this design! It seems like every detail has been thought out! Great job!

However, if I do use your design, I'll need to edit it a bit first (if I don't even do that successfully, then, sadly, I probably won't be able to use this), so I was just wondering what kind of file formats you have for the parts. Do you have STEPs or Fusion documents (f3d) that I can open in Autodesk Fusion 360 and use (STL's are pretty much useless)?

[neotko 1,406]

Show me a step file that has your 4mm bowden and I will try to edit it this week. I can't send the step file since most of the inner measurements are based on the step file that @IRobertI sent me from his IRobertI feeder.

Yea stl edition is a mess. But I think I can change it for more normal bowdens so more users can use it.