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perlguy

Troubleshooting bad prints

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I'm having issues again with printing some items.

I am trying to print this item: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:59580

The solid base seems to print just fine, but when the printer gets to the smaller vertical parts, they print very weak and/or very stringy.

I am including 2 photos of my prints.

I've tried resetting the Cura settings back to the defaults.

I've also tried with infill of 50% and even 100%.

The photos show the result of trying to use the latest version of Slic3r.

My Slic3r settings were:

PRINT SETTINGS

--- Layers & Perimeters ---

Layer Height:

Layer height: 0.2mm

First layer height: 100%

Vertical Shells:

Perimeters (minimum): 3

Randomize starting points: TRUE

Generate extra perimeters when needed: TRUE

Horizontal Shells:

Solid layers: Top: 3 Bottom: 3

Advanced:

Avoid crossing perimeters: FALSE

External perimeters first: FALSE

--- Infill ---

Infill:

Fill density: .5

Fill Pattern: rectilinear

Top/Bottom Fill Pattern: rectiliniar

Advanced:

Infill every: 1 layers

Only infill where needed: FALSE

Solid infill every: 0 layers

Fill angle: 45

Solid infill threshold area: 70

Only retract when crossing perimeters: FALSE

Infill before perimeters: FALSE

--- Speed ---

Speed for print moves

Perimeters: 60 mm/s

Small perimeters: 60 mm/s

External perimeters: 100%

Infill: 60 mm/s

Solid infill: 60 mm/s

Top solid infill: 60 mm/s

Support material: 60 mm/s

Bridges: 60 mm/s

Gap fill: 20 mm/s

Speed for non-print moves

Travel: 130 mm/s

Modifiers

First layer speed: 50%

Acceleration control (advanced)

Perimeters: 0

Infill: 0

Bridge: 0

Default: 0

--- Skirt and Brim ---

Skirt

Loops: 1

Distance from object: 6mm

Skirt height: 1 (layers)

Minimum extrusion length: 0

Brim

Brim width: 6mm

--- Support Material ---

Support Material

Generate support material: FALSE

Overhang threshold: 45

Enforce support for the first: 0 (layers)

Raft

Raft layers: 0

Options for support material and raft

Pattern: rectilinear

Pattern spacing: 2.5

Pattern angle: 0

Interface layers: 0

Interface pattern spacing: 0

--- Notes ---

N/A

--- Output Options ---

N/A

--- Multiple Extruders ---

Extruders

Perimeter extruder: 1

Infill extruder: 1

Support material extruder: 1

--- Advanced ---

Extrusion Width

Default extrusion width: 0

First layer: 200%

Perimeters: 0

Infill: 0

Solid infill: 0

Top solid infill: 0

Support material: 0

Flow

Bridge flow ratio: 1

Other

Threads: 4

Resolution: 0

*** Filament Settings ***

--- Filament ---

Filament

Diameter: 2.86

Extrusion Multiplier: 1

Temperature

Extruder: 230

Bed: 100

--- Cooling ---

Enable

Enable Cooling: FALSE

Fan settings

Fan speed: Min: 35 Max: 110

Bridges fan speed: 100

Disable fan for the first: 1 (layers)

Keep fan always on: FALSE

Cooling thresholds

Enable fan if layer print time is below: 60

Slow down if layer print time is below: 15

Min print speed: 10 mm/s

*** Printer Settings ***

--- General ---

Size and coordinates

Bed size: x: 225 y: 225

Print center: x: 112.5 y: 112.5

Z offset: 0

Firmware:

G-code flavor: RepRap (Marlin/Sprinter)

Use relative E distances: FALSE

Capabilities

Extruders: 1

Advanced

Vibration limit: 0

--- Custom G-code ---

Start G-Code:

G28; home all axes

End G-Code:

M104 S0; turn off temperature

G28 X0; Home X axis

M84; Disable motors

Layer change G-code:

Tool change G-code:

--- Extruder 1 ---

Size

Nozzle diameter: 0.4

Position

Extruder offset: x: 0 y: 0

Retraction

Length: 4.5

Lift Z: 0

Speed: 40

Extra length on start: 0

Minimum travel after retraction: 5

Retract on layer change: TRUE

Retraction when tool is disabled

Length: 10

Extra length on restart: 0

Wow, I think that is all of the setting, I am going to save that as a template for the next time I need it!

I will try to attach my photos now, thanks!

bad_print_04232013_01.jpg

bad_print_04232013_02.jpg

 

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This is odd... because the print part looks under extruded, but there's not just stringing but actual extensive in air extrusion it looks like. Is retraction happening when you are printing?

Do you see the extruder gear turn backwards, and then jump forwards again? There's a huge amount of stringing there... it's almost like the extruder isn't doing the backwards part of the retraction, just the forwards part.

Also, have you upgraded the firmware recently to a build-your-own version of Marlin? If so, you probably got the retraction speed fix, in which case a retraction speed of 40 is probably too much - try reducing it to about 25 or 30 instead.

 

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I will check my firmware and also try to tweak my retraction speed.

I really appreciate the tips! There are so many things that can happen.

Along those lines, does anyone know of a wiki site or something where we could post photos and slicer settings - and then have some sort of troubleshooting information on how to fix each type of printing problem that people are facing? That could be a very helpful thing!

Thanks again!

 

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Along those lines, does anyone know of a wiki site or something where we could post photos and slicer settings - and then have some sort of troubleshooting information on how to fix each type of printing problem that people are facing? That could be a very helpful thing!

 

Right here is about as close as it gets!

i think you are over retracting/speed is too high as well, and it's causing a bunch of small chews into the filament that are causing slippage. Reason being, when you look at the top, it looks like once there is a constant layer again, it starts attempting to print, but there is nothing to print on. I would disable retract on layer change as well.

 

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Thanks!

Also, I am on github and have downloaded the latest Marlin firmware. However, in the Marlin directory there is no Marlin.pde file!

I am on a Mac, I've tried running "make", but it just throws an error.

As far as I remember, the Marlin.pde file used to be in the directory.

Any ideas about how I can get it back?

Thanks!

 

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No idea about the pde file. It can be built fairly easily on a mac using make - that's what I do. Install the 0023 version arduino application, and then edit your make file along the following lines...

# This defined the board you are compiling for (see Configuration.h for the options)

HARDWARE_MOTHERBOARD ?= 7

 

# Arduino source install directory, and version number

ARDUINO_INSTALL_DIR ?= /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java

ARDUINO_VERSION ?= 23

 

# You can optionally set a path to the avr-gcc tools. Requires a trailing slash. (ex: /usr/local/avr-gcc/bin)

AVR_TOOLS_PATH ?= /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/tools/avr/bin/

 

Adjusting the paths to whatever is right for your machine. Then in the terminal, cd into the inner Marlin directory, and just type:

make

You should end up with a hex file in the applet subdirectory, which you can then install with e.g., Cura.

If you get errors, please let me know - I'm in the process of writing up a tutorial on it, and I'd like to know what I'm forgetting about the process :-)

 

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illuminarti,

Thanks.

One step that you will want to include is either a how-to or a link to instructions for installing the command-line tools. One of the boxes that I am working on doesn't yet have them installed.

I look forward to seeing the tutorial!

 

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I also had to install the avr tools.

I've made the changes to the Makefile, but I get the following when I try to run make

 


3Ds-Mac-mini:Marlin 3dprinting$ make
CC /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/wiring.c
CC /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/wiring_analog.c
CC /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/wiring_digital.c
CC /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/wiring_pulse.c
CC /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/wiring_shift.c
CC /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/WInterrupts.c
In file included from /usr/local/CrossPack-AVR-20130212/lib/gcc/avr/4.6.2/../../../../avr/include/util/delay.h:44:0,
from /usr/local/CrossPack-AVR-20130212/lib/gcc/avr/4.6.2/../../../../avr/include/avr/delay.h:37,
from /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/wiring_private.h:30,
from /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/WInterrupts.c:34:
/usr/local/CrossPack-AVR-20130212/lib/gcc/avr/4.6.2/../../../../avr/include/math.h:426:15: error: expected identifier or '(' before 'double'
/usr/local/CrossPack-AVR-20130212/lib/gcc/avr/4.6.2/../../../../avr/include/math.h:426:15: error: expected ')' before '>=' token
make: *** [applet/WInterrupts.o] Error 1
3Ds-Mac-mini:Marlin 3dprinting$ sudo make
CC /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/WInterrupts.c
In file included from /usr/local/CrossPack-AVR-20130212/lib/gcc/avr/4.6.2/../../../../avr/include/util/delay.h:44:0,
from /usr/local/CrossPack-AVR-20130212/lib/gcc/avr/4.6.2/../../../../avr/include/avr/delay.h:37,
from /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/wiring_private.h:30,
from /Applications/Arduino.app/Contents/Resources/Java/hardware/arduino/cores/arduino/WInterrupts.c:34:
/usr/local/CrossPack-AVR-20130212/lib/gcc/avr/4.6.2/../../../../avr/include/math.h:426:15: error: expected identifier or '(' before 'double'
/usr/local/CrossPack-AVR-20130212/lib/gcc/avr/4.6.2/../../../../avr/include/math.h:426:15: error: expected ')' before '>=' token
make: *** [applet/WInterrupts.o] Error 1

I'll keep poking around but it isn't looking promising.

 

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Your brim looks too thin - you should relevel using a piece of paper. I think you started printing with the z stage too high by maybe .1mm. This can grind your filament and cause all kinds of trouble.

However this has nothing to do with what you are complaining about because it printed the base of your part just fine and by the time it got to the trouble section you are fine.

Rather than rebuild marlin, consider just lowering the retraction speed to 25 as illuminarti suggested. You probably already have the latest Marlin as I believe it came with cura 13.13. Watch the retraction wheel and see if it seems insanely fast and makes bad noises. If so, lower it by another factor of 2X.

This is a very strange printing problem to me.

 

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If you download the arduino ide v0023 from:

http://arduino.googlecode.com/files/arduino-0023.dmg

Then it looks like the avr tools are all in there, in the directory that I referenced in my makefile snippet above, I think.

Did you trigger that make from the right directory... you should be in the Marlin source code, cd'd to the directory that has the freshly-edited makefile in it.

 

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I'm very curious if editing the code like you did helped at all.

If I had one guess to explain the error in your image (one I have seen on my printbed several times) it would be this: you broke some (or all like me?) of the blades off of the extruder fan and your extruder has a metal gear?

So here's the idea, if the filament conducts heat up from the extruder barrel and to the extruder-gear area it will make it easier for the gear to "cut" or "strip" the filament, rather than pushing the filament forward.

 

This issue is compounded by

 

  • A clogged/partially clogged nozzle
  • Wet Filament
  • A weakened or misshapen extruder tension spring (pushes the filament against the extruder gear with a wheel)

 

Once the filament starts to strip, the torn peices of plastic fill the extruder's gearteeth, which make further stripping more likely.

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