Questions about designs contained within the base layer

[SirUlrich 0]

 

Good Day!

 

I am looking for wisdom and experience from folks when it comes to designs embedded within the base layer and first layers... I am very much so a novice and have printed mostly premade designs from Thingiverse and elsewhere, and have designed a few unique items myself. My question here today comes with trying to replicate design aspects from Srifraf on Thingiverse into my own designs.

 

Example here. I'd like to duplicate the slight design from the base layer into my own work, but regardless of how I design it or try to slice it, Cura's preview tends to print the design on the bottom 3 layers instead of only the base layer and then a solid 2nd layer which is what happens with the designs by Rifraf... Working with the Ender 3, I've tried designing the token with a print height of .16 to accommodate the magic number (.04) and of the "infill" of the token set .20 above the print bed. Setting the base layer height at .20, and then the rest of the print at .16, the print preview still shows multiple layers before it starts laying over the design. 

 

And now, thank you Murphey, I just sliced it and the preview shows the 2nd layer beginning the complete infill 🙄 ... I'm about to go print the new slice and will report back on how it looks...

 

I would still love to hear all y'all's thoughts and experience on this!!! 

 

Thank You!

 

NO AP Token - 08 or 16 print height - 3 (1).stl 1-NO AP Token - 08 or 16 print height - 3 (1).gcode

[SirUlrich 0]

Failed to print as pretty as the Rifraf stuff... I stopped the print after 3 layers to save the PLA. 😕

 

Thoughts, Comments, Concerns... Declarations of Heresy... 

 

Thanks. 

[SirUlrich 0]

Can I get a Moderator Approval please? 😊

 

Thank you!

 

[johnse 31]

Your posts went through. I just don’t have an answer for you.

[peggyb 171]

set the 'initial layer height' to 0.3, then the next layer will be solid.

[SirUlrich 0]

3 hours ago, peggyb said:

set the 'initial layer height' to 0.3, then the next layer will be solid.

 

Thank you for the suggestion, Peggy, It doesn't look like it will result in what I'm desiring though. 

 

This preview shows a base layer without any of the design element... I recognize it is probably impossible to do a full, bau relief on the base layer without some intentionality in designing and water soluble support, or something... but I'm looking for the visual design element like in the example from Rifraf on Thingiverse...   

[peggyb 171]

play with the initial layer thickness until the letters show in the first layer.

There is also another little trick:

print the first layer thin with the letters, pause the print, change the colour and resume the print.

In your case I would start with one thin layer with the letters and stop the print, change the colour, change the first layer thickness to a solid first layer and print over the first layer.

Info from an old topic:

 

[geert_2 558]

In your photos, the next layers have nothing to stick to, so they print in the air and are dragged around. You need to find a way to make them stick. It is like when the glass bed is calibrated wrong, and you have too much distance between nozzle and bed.

 

What about trying this method:

- make sure your nozzle is rather close to the glass bed, so the first layer is squished very well into the glass,

- make the indentations 0.11mm deep in the CAD design,

- make the first layer 0.10mm thick in Cura,

- make the following layers 0.2 or 0.3mm thick in Cura,

 

Then the first layer is really squeezed into the glass, and there is a good change that the following layers will still have enough bonding. I am not sure this is going to work, and if the pattern is going to be visible enough, but it might be worth trying?

 

This is what the bottom of the first layer should look like:

 

[SirUlrich 0]

I tried again Geert, following your train of though while trying to hold to the Ender 3's .04 magic number. 

 

I placed the core at a height of .10 above the print bed. I printed the base layer at .1, and following layers thicker with the magic number. The bottom of the token came out very clean, but with the design only visible while the light is reflecting off the surface perfectly. I'm totally going to keep this one, but still try fiddling more when I have more time... 

 

My ultimate goal is the style of design in the OP with the Gyropolis Hex piece. 

[SirUlrich 0]

 

It isn't quite what I had initially thought of, but it looks like the Gyropolis Hex is a Negative Design Element while mine far more Positive Design Element, if that makes any sense at all to anyone else... (Would those even be the correct terms???) ... Could that be the issue?

 

[geert_2 558]

Yes that is going to have an effect. The bigger the contact area of the bottom layer, the better it is going to stick. And the smaller the design elements, the easier they can bridge gaps without turning into spaghetti.

 

I don't know the official terminology, but usually I speak about "raised" or "recessed" text or design features. So if the recessed seems to work better, definitely try that.

[TheodorK 11]

If the text won't show on the bottom layer it might help to flip the model upside down (only if the other side is flat). Most of the times the top layer comes out much better than the bottom layer, because this layer is squeezed onto the build plate, as you can see in your first picture @SirUlrich, the left lide is squished more than the right side.

When the print is flipped around the text sits on the top side and this will probably yield much better result, tekst wise. Because of this I always try to print all the details on the top side.

 

Also make sure that the text you want to print does not have smaller lines than the 'line width' set in cura, otherwise the lines will dissapear because they become to small to print.

[SirUlrich 0]

7 hours ago, TheodorK said:

If the text won't show on the bottom layer it might help to flip the model upside down (only if the other side is flat). Most of the times the top layer comes out much better than the bottom layer, because this layer is squeezed onto the build plate, as you can see in your first picture @SirUlrich, the left side is squished more than the right side.

When the print is flipped around the text sits on the top side and this will probably yield much better result, text wise. Because of this I always try to print all the details on the top side.

 

Also make sure that the text you want to print does not have smaller lines than the 'line width' set in cura, otherwise the lines will dissapear because they become to small to print.

 

Thank you for weighing in @Theodork! I do appreciate the thoughts as I am still a complete novice! 

 

The design I desire to be a through-and-through, the bottom is mirrored by identical to the top. The two photos are the top and bottom sides of the two tokens I allowed to print all the way through. And there is far greater detail on the top of the print than the bottom. ... ... ... I'm probably going to attempt to do a negative/recessed impression on the bottom and raised on the top, attempting to portray the designed being stamped through the token... but once I have a bit more time. (I have two college papers to work on today which I have procrastinated on some.) 

 

As to the line width being too thin, I've already discovered that 😖 But it is a very good reminder!

 

Once again, I appreciate any and all feedback on this! Thanks!

 

 

Edited October 23, 2019 by SirUlrich