Not all settings are saved and prime tower extrudes the wrong extruder.

[JimF2023 0]

• New member
•  0
• 1 post

• I posted this a on another topic earler this morrning

Posted just now · Strange purging behavior with a prime tower

I posted this a on another topic (Strange purging behavior with a prime tower) earler this morrning but it was old and no resolution.

I when back to my 3mf file to see if there were any settings for dual extrusion that may change the behavor when priming but there is no extruder specific setting in Dual Extruder settings.

The models used in this are a disc (yellow) and a number, the number (red) is to be printed on the disc.

What I did notice with the Move setting is that it dose not keep the Z position once Cura has fully loaded.

When the model is imported it is in the correct Z position but then is reset to Drop Down Model even though I set Lock Model.

 

The other issue I have is saving the gcode, after slicing the model the button changes to Save to Disc which opens a window so the file can be saved thats fine.

When a removable drive is connected the button changes to Save to Removeable Drive but when clicked it just saves the file regardless if it exists and if it does exist it is not overwritten

 

What would be good with the dual extruder is to seperate hotend and extruder so you would have Dual Extruder and Dual Hotend.

Cura sees dual extruder as dual hot end

 

 

Hi I can see that this has been an issue since these post in 2020.

I have the same issue in 2023, I have Geeetech A10M which has 2 extruders in 1 hot end out.

The print adheasion is set for extruder 2 and the first part is with exruder 2. After laying the first layer there was a 2-3 second pause over the part first layer then moved to the prime tower and swiched to extruder 1 then moved to the part and switched to extruder 2, this proccess continues.

Extruder 1 has no reason to do any thin till 1.5mm

The other issue is the temperature settings are changed at line 30844;

T0
G92 E0
M104 T1 S0 <-- line 30844
G1 F600 Z1.511
;MESH:NOMESH

 

The final layer ends at line 44399;

G1 X66.592 Y134.814 E68.91875
;TIME_ELAPSED:3184.966974
G1 F6000 E63.91875 <-- line 44399
M107
G91
G1 E-5

 

I have add the gcode, 3mf files and a photo of the finished model, I hope to find out why this is happening please.

GA_12_Lucida Handwriting-1.5Z.3mf

[Slashee_the_Cow 295]

1 hour ago, JimF2023 said:

The other issue I have is saving the gcode, after slicing the model the button changes to Save to Disc which opens a window so the file can be saved thats fine.

When a removable drive is connected the button changes to Save to Removeable Drive but when clicked it just saves the file regardless if it exists and if it does exist it is not overwritten

There should be an arrow button next to "Save to Removable Drive", which brings up a list of currently connected removable drives or just the regular "Save to Disk" option.

 

I did already respond in the other topic you posted in, which you should at the very least have provided a link to (especially since it has a download of the gcode), I'm not sure how much @gr5 likes someone posting a duplicate just because they don't get a solution in under four hours.

 

As I said there, I don't have a printer with two extruders, and I didn't even know you could get printers with two extruders but a single hot end (mostly because I've never looked at dual extruder printers because they're out of my price range) so I have no idea how well Cura handles that. Someone who knows more than me (maybe @GregValiant) will have to step in on that one.

[JimF2023 0]

Hi Greg, Thanks for the replies.

The saving to a removable drive issue I did find the arrow change to the hard drive. I think it's a bit pointless to have a feature that doesn't do as most ofther programs do when there is a duplicate file and ask to replace it or overwrite it.

The first post was on thread from 2020. I thought I inclued a photo of the finshed print, gcode and 3mf file.

The Geetech A10M was the same price ($275 AU) or less than some of the single extruder machines at that time.

 

The 2 in 1 extruder doesn't need a standby tempreature it can keep running, in the past I have edited the gcode and inserted T0 and T1 at predetermined layer heights. I have done the same with tempreatures with wood pla.

 

What I am going to do now is swop the filiment over so T0 does the first part then T1 for the second see how that goes.

 

GA_12_Lucida Handwriting-1.5Z.gcode GA_12_Lucida Handwriting-1.5Z.3mf

[Slashee_the_Cow 295]

2 hours ago, JimF2023 said:

Hi Greg, Thanks for the replies.

My name isn't even close to Greg, but you're welcome.

 

2 hours ago, JimF2023 said:

The saving to a removable drive issue I did find the arrow change to the hard drive. I think it's a bit pointless to have a feature that doesn't do as most ofther programs do when there is a duplicate file and ask to replace it or overwrite it.

A lot of people (myself included) will print from an SD card. The idea is that all I have to do is pop it in the reader, Cura sees it and I just click the button and it saves to the card (and it assumes if I'm using the same project name, it's probably just an updated version). Obviously not everyone thinks this way, I think it would be nice to have an option for it but as far as I'm aware, there isn't one. Not exactly an "option" in the traditional sense, but check my next post for a kludge which might get it how you want.

 

2 hours ago, JimF2023 said:

The Geetech A10M was the same price ($275 AU) or less than some of the single extruder machines at that time.

Wow, less than I paid for my Ender-3 v2 Neo (about $100 less). Didn't know that sort of thing was available, but I know people with a couple of Ender-3s that highly recommended them so I'll admit I wasn't really looking elsewhere.

 

2 hours ago, JimF2023 said:

The 2 in 1 extruder doesn't need a standby tempreature it can keep running, in the past I have edited the gcode and inserted T0 and T1 at predetermined layer heights. I have done the same with tempreatures with wood pla.

There's an plugin available called Duplicate (or just click "Marketplace" at the top right of Cura and scroll down to find it) which copies settings from one extruder to all of them, that might help in your situation but obviously I don't know personally.

Edited August 31, 2023 by Slashee_the_Cow
Added referral to next post

[Slashee_the_Cow 295]

12 minutes ago, Slashee_the_Cow said:

I think it would be nice to have an option for it but as far as I'm aware, there isn't one.

Okay so this may be one of the kludgiest kludges I've done and I can't guarantee it won't break anything else, but:

If you go to C:\Program Files\UltiMaker Cura 5.4.0\share\cura\plugins\ (or wherever the installation directory for your version is) there should be a folder called RemovableDriveOutputDevice. Close Cura if it's open, and try moving that folder anywhere on your computer that isn't in a Cura installation (just moving it to my documents is fine), you might get a prompt saying you need permission to move something out of Program Files, just say yes. I say move with emphasis because in case it breaks something else (I've managed to get half the UI to not show up just by editing one line in a configuration file which has almost nothing to do with the UI) you can just move it back instead of reinstalling Cura.

[JimF2023 0]

Removing the folder worked the Save to Removeable Drive doesn't showup now, thank you.

I stop using this when I found it diden't overwrite the existing file.

Renaming it has the same result, I just put a X at the beginning, I'm using Cura 3.3, I installed 3.4 and had some very strange things happen. I uninstalled 3.4 and went back to 3.3 but I had to remove all traces of Cura and reinstall 3.3.

Once I am certain every thing is working I'll try 3.4.

 

Changing the the filiment to match the print order so T0 prints the first part and T1 does the second fix most of the problem. I think the pause at extruder change is machine related as it does the same thing when I have preheated for bed leveling. 

 

The problem with not keeping the Z position setting was a preference setting to automaticaly drop models to the bed.

 

The photo is the progress of these test printsr 1s are a 1 piece model and the 12s are 2 piece model.

The solid color 1s are red glow in the datk PLA and yellow glow in the dark PLA and the first mix was done manually

and the second set to use T1 then I inseted T0 and changed the top and bottom pattern to Concentric.

They are to be used on a clock face eventually. Just need to find a way to stop the pause when change extuders, I think it is the temperature change when changing extruders.

[gr5 2,181]

Why are you using such an old version of Cura?  Isn't that from quite a few years ago?

[JimF2023 0]

OOppss that should be 5.3/4

[JimF2023 0]

I just saw on the main feed people downloading 15.6, the latest release I found is 5.4.

[Slashee_the_Cow 295]

29 minutes ago, JimF2023 said:

I just saw on the main feed people downloading 15.6, the latest release I found is 5.4.

They restarted the numbering system (I think when Ultimaker took over), I used to use 15.04.6 to slice for my Mod-T back before its motherboard had a heart attack and started printing random rubbish.

[gr5 2,181]

Versioning used to be by year and month.  So version 15.6.X came out in June of 2015.  Original version of Cura was by David aka Daid who Ultimaker later hired so he could work on it full time.  One of Daid's requirements was that it would stay open source and UM was fine with that.

 

After many years of Daid improving Cura as an employee of UM, it was decided to scrap the whole thing (mostly) and rewrite it from scratch.  The GUI for sure.  I think possibly the "engine" portion - the part that actually slices - might have been kept.  Not sure.  Anyway the first version with the entirely new GUI was Cura 2.0.  It wasn't very good.  By 3.0 it was probably better than version 15.

 

Version 15.X still works quite well for printers with Marlin (99% of printers out there but falling fast with klipper and others) and often gives better results for certain parts on (for example) an Ultimaker 2.

 

For dual material prints on an Ultimaker 3/S3/S5/S7, don't use cura 15!

[GregValiant 1,272]

@JimF2023 Do you have the "Printer Settings" plugin loaded? (it's in the MarketPlace).

Two of the settings you need are in the Printer Settings as "Extruders Share Heater" and "Extruders Share Nozzle".  They wll eliminate the standby temperature changes.

 

There is a post-processor for 2-in-1-out hot ends called "ColorMix".  As an exercise I wrote a new post-processor for both 2 and 3-in-one-out printers.  It has not been tested on a real printer as I only have a virtual multi-extruder in Cura.

If you feel like playing with it I'll post it.  It supports both Constant mix and Gradient mix.  I need to revisit Purge Towers as right now I just have it move to a corner and purge.

 

 

[JimF2023 0]

I didn't have "Printer Settings" installed so I installed it but could not find any new settings.

I upgrade from Cura 5.3 to 5.4 when it was released and I started having problems with thw gcode not being complete.

I only found the incomplet when the print just stopped and even after checking the machine for loose/bad hotend wires, the print would stop in the exact same position every time so I opened an old file that I knew worked.

I oend the 3mf file with Cura and changed the nozzle size and layer heights and when I tryed to run it the machine reset.

I opened the gcode to find it was corrupted and while I was in the gcode folder I noticed that the file that kept stoppng was half the size of the same model with different settings.

[JimF2023 0]

I have a program that came with my printer called Color Mixer V1.1 I did have a bit of a play with it with the first print but have just been working with Cura.

I would like to try your post-processor, is ColorMix the app name?

 

[GregValiant 1,272]

"I opened the gcode to find it was corrupted and while I was in the gcode folder I noticed that the file that kept stoppng was half the size of the same model with different settings." 

Two things can happen to cause that.  When Cura passes the file to the operating system to save it to a removeable drive the operating system writes the file to disk but does not check the drive for errors or to see if the file will fit on the drive.  If the file won't fit it gets truncated.  If there are errors on the drive then part of the file could get written to a bad sector on the SD card when it's saved or when it's simply copied from the hard drive to the card.  In either case the file is incomplete and ends abruptly.  Re-formatting the SD card will often solve the problem.

 

 "I installed (Printer Settings) but could not find any new settings."

To the right of the Setting Search box is an button with three lines on it.  It's the Setting Visibility Tool.  Click on it and set the visibility to "All".  Within Printer Settings will be "Extruders Share Heater" and "Extruders Share Nozzle".  They both need to be checked.

 

I started out fresh and wrote "Multi-Extruder Color Mixer" so it would include printers with 3inOneOut hot ends as well as the TwoInOneOut models.  There are certain rules that need to be applied (for example "prime towers" are not allowed) so I'll send a PM regarding it.

[JimF2023 0]

I have reinstalled Cura 5.4 from a fresh dowload after removing all traces of previous Cura installations which I found in locations I didn't know existed in Windows 10.

 

"When Cura passes the file to the operating system to save it to a removeable drive the operating system writes the file to disk but does not check the drive for errors or to see if the file will fit on the drive"

The file size was wrong from Cura and even reslicing and saving the same model and settings would have a different size but still not complete, but I think I may have an issue with my PC as there were other strange things happening not related to Cura which I think has been resolved so far. Some programs would not run or would crash as soon as I tried to use it.

 

I have now installed the "Printer Settings" and yes I found the settings and there are some new settings for nozzle length and out diameter, but I'm not sure how they will affect the print.

 

The speed, acceleration and jerk settings I'll need to get from my machine, the nozzle length to lowest part of the print head is a bit vague. Is it from the tip of the nozzle to where the nozzle seats in the hotend or to the lowest point that would make contact with a print surface?

 

The A10M uses M7 nozzles and at the time I could only find M6 nozzles with different nozzle sizes except for the MK10 nozzles which I decided to try but they are designed to have the bowden tube go into them.

I think the size of th MK10 is a cause of my ooze and stringing problems because of the larger size holding the heat even when I used a peice of bowden tube and I have made an aluminum insert which are difficult to remove.

I plan to make a M6 to M7 adaptor and try an M6 nozzle which I purchased by mistake.

 

The prints in the photos were printed with a 0.2 MK10 nozzle with the aluminum insert

 

Thank you for your help.

 

[gr5 2,181]

On 9/3/2023 at 7:57 PM, JimF2023 said:

The speed, acceleration and jerk settings I'll need to get from my machine, the nozzle length to lowest part of the print head is a bit vague

speed/accel/jerk settings are so that cura can estimate how long the print will take.  Only.  It doesn't affect slicing.  I still think it's worth entering that data as knowing print times is very useful. [edit: I was corrected, the speed/accel/jerk settings that determine the slice times are somewhere else - but they definitely are somewhere in the machine profile]

 

I believe nozzle length to lowest part of the print head is only for a feature called "print one at a time" which is off by default.  If you are printing multiple parts in "one at a time" mode then the printer will print one, then bring nozzle to bed again and print another.  In order to do this you have to tell cura print head size so it avoids putting parts too close together.  Also there is the "gantry height" or something similar.

 

Wait - maybe I'm wrong about "nozzle length...".  I'm not sure what that is used for.  Something obscure maybe?

[JimF2023 0]

I have used the "Print one at time" and Cura used the "Gantry Height" if I remember correctly with a boarder around the model that mached the "Printhead Settings" in 'Machine Settings". The gantry height is set at 28mm which I guesstermate to be the disrance from the bottom of the gantry to the bottom of the part fan duct.

The distance between the gantry and print bed with the current MK10 nozzle 34.5mm when homed and the 6.5mm difference id what I will try the first time.

The only thing I can think of is getting a more accurate tip temperater

[GregValiant 1,272]

Within the Printer Settings, the Accel and Speeds are used to keep a user from entering excessive numbers in the regular settings boxes.  If you have a Maximum Z  speed of 10mm/sec and try to put 20mm/sec into the Z-hops Speed box in the Speed settings it will turn the box red and refuse to slice.  Those settings are often contained within a printer definition file so unless a user has a problem somewhere else they should be fine.

You would need to query the printer with M503 and see the response to know what is currently set in the printer.  You could send commands (M201, M203, etc. followed by M500) via a gcode file and change those settings in the printer.  Cura never knows what the "real" printer settings are as there is no 2 way communication.

 

Yea, some settings are pretty obscure like "feeder wheel diameter".  How that would affect slicing I have no idea.  Maybe it's important to Ultimaker printers.  Other settings like the Steps/mm of the axes and XYZ "end-stop in positive direction" aren't used anywhere by Cura.

[JimF2023 0]

I have had play with accel and jerk I was not sure how the "Printer settings" used the default values dr5 said they are only for the print time and have no control over the machin.

I have just tried your Color Mixer, the only chang I made was to the number of extruders from 4 to 3 (the instruction said number of ectruders + 1).

The extruders on the A10M are T0 and T1 when I looked at the gcode there is only T0 and T2.

The photo attached shows what happened when I ran the code, T0 extruded twice.

I changed the nozzle to 0.4 because I didn't want to chang to many settingss before I tried it and the initial purge values because the were to intense and they usully work fine.

I have reread the instructions in th python file and I didn't disable T1 so I just tried it but I can'yt slice it because the model is outside the build volume. Changing "Special Modes" from the default "All at once" to "One at a time" made no difference.

 

Where/how to enable M163 and M164? "This script REQUIRES that M163 and M164 are enabled in the firmware."

 

What have I missed?

 

[GregValiant 1,272]

Maybe you didn't miss anything, but I might have.  I'll take a look in a little bit.  T0 should start the print and do the purge lines.  After that is done the nozzle should move to the corner and purge so the selected mix ratio is ready to use.   I may indeed have missed something there.

If you would be so kind as to post that gcode file here it would help.

 

T2 is the "virtual" mixing extruder and is defined by the M164 lines in the gcode.  It will run a percentage of T0 and a percentage of T1.

 

If you set up for a Gradient mix then there are settings for the "Start %" and the "Ending %".

T0 in the mix = true

T0 Start % = 100

T0 End % = 0

T1 in the mix = true

T1 Start % = 0

T1 End % = 100

That set up will start out with T0 providing all the filament.  At each layer change the mix changes and T0% goes down while T1% goes up.  At the end of the print all the filament would be supplied by T1.

The sum of the "Start %"'s must always be 100 and the sum of the "End %" must also always be 100.  There is a message that will pop up if there is an error and the post will exit without modifying  the gcode.

 

I know it's a complicated script but I think the results will be worthwhile once it's working correctly, but there will be responsibility on the users end to figure out how to get it to work for them.  Prints in Vase Mode should be pretty cool.

 

 

[JimF2023 0]

Success! I have been able to print a gradient.

There is an issue with the plugin "Printer Settings" when I updated the default to match my machine Cura through error messages which is suprising because gr5 said that these settings where only used to calculate the print time.

 

Retraction Speed, Retract Speed, Z Hop Speed and Retraction Prime Speed

 

Here are my current machine stettings;

Printer is now online.
echo:Marlin Marlin: 1.1.8
echo: Last Updated: 2017-12-25 12:00 | Author: (none, default config)
echo:Compiled: Mar 30 2021
echo: Free Memory: 2440  PlannerBufferBytes: 1360
Using tool 0.
echo:V121 stored settings retrieved (614 bytes; crc 17040)
echo:poweroff stored settings retrieved (57 bytes; crc 3525)
read file dir: /
read file name: ga_12_~2.gco
echo:  G21    ; Units in mm
echo:  M149 C ; Units in Celsius
echo:Filament settings: Disabled
echo:  M200 D1.75
echo:  M200 D0
echo:Steps per unit:
echo:  M92 X81.00 Y81.00 Z401.00 E144.00
echo:Maximum feedrates (units/s):
echo:  M203 X500.00 Y500.00 Z5.00 E25.00
echo:Maximum Acceleration (units/s2):
echo:  M201 X500 Y500 Z100 E1000
echo:Acceleration (units/s2): P<print_accel> R<retract_accel> T<travel_accel>
echo:  M204 P500.00 R500.00 T1000.00
echo:Advanced: S<min_feedrate> T<min_travel_feedrate> B<min_segment_time_us> X<max_xy_jerk> Z<max_z_jerk> E<max_e_jerk>
echo:  M205 S0.00 T0.00 B20000 X15.00 Y15.00 Z5.00 E6.00
echo:Auto Bed Leveling:
echo:  M420 S0 Z0.00
echo:Material heatup parameters:
echo:  M145 S0 H190 B60 F0
echo:  M145 S1 H245 B90 F0
echo:PID settings:
echo:  M301 P40.13 I3.16 D127.37
echo:  M304 P30.04 I2.11 D107.06
echo:Z-Probe Offset (mm):
echo:  M851 Z-0.50
 hardware version:1.02echo:Fixed parameter (6 bytes; crc 38692)
echo:SD card ok

I have included the errror message images, the first is when I disabled T1 or T0 and the second is the settings that had a conflict.

You will probably wonder why the Steps per unit on the extruder are not what Geeetech usualy have it's becuase I replaced the original with MK8 dual drive extruders, the origal was E395.00.

I will play some more and keep you up dated with how I go, I hope this helps and thank you for your help.

 

 

A10M_MultiMixCaliCube_2.3mf

[GregValiant 1,272]

Gr5 was off a bit there.  The speeds and accelerations in the Printer Settings are used by Cura to put limits on the settings you can enter into the boxes elsewhere in the program.  If you have the Maximum Z Speed set to 10 in Printer Settings and you put in a Z-hop speed of 20 up in the Speed section then Cura will refuse to slice.  Cura uses the actual print and travel speeds that you enter in the Speed section to calculate the print time.

 

There was no way to utilize a purge tower in post process so the script just moves the head to a corner and purges there and then retracts.  I figured since it only does a purge on a major change and not while doing a gradient it would be OK (if not great).

 

In a  sidenote - your Geeetech is running the same Marlin firmware version as my Ender 3 Pro.

 

 

[JimF2023 0]

1 hour ago, GregValiant said:

There was no way to utilize a purge tower in post process

You have a Z height to purge at x00 y00, can they be given an X Y value and do the same purge somewhere else?

 

The Geetech is a clone of the ender 3 pro, I don't know about the 2 in 1 out hotend.

[GregValiant 1,272]

"You have a Z height to purge at x00 y00,can they be given an X Y value"  

 

The Z height to purge is:  If the nozzle is below 12mm then move up 12mm to purge.  If the nozzle is already above 12mm then move up 2mm just to clear the part for the move and then purge.

Enter whatever you want in the X and Y boxes.  If you were to enter X230 Y230 then the purge location would be near the right rear corner.