UM2+ restarts only printing PA

[3dDruckIng 0]

Hi,

I started testing the new PA from colorfabb: A minimum hot-end temperature of 260C is recommended and a heated bed at 40C / 50C is advised

 

But my UM2+ restarts (black screen, stops extruding, restarts and shows the default menu) during the print of the second layer: slicer S3D; hot-end temperature 260°C; bed 50°C

 

What I tested:

• Different parts: same problem
• Different slicer: same problem with cura (restarts after approx. 4th layer) 
• Control of the hot-end temperature : The restarts happen with a hot-end temperatur of 259-260 °C
• Reducing the bed temperature: 50/40/30 °C same problem

The solution:

• Disable the heated bed or T<20°C and the prints are fine

 

But what I don't understand, I don't have any problems printing nGen (hot-end 227°C, bed 80°C)

• The hot-end should be fine: can print 260°C
• The bed should be fine: can print nGen with 80°C bed
• The power supply should be fine ? Printing with a 80°C bed should consume more power than printing 260°C?

 

Is it the mainboard? The UM2+ should be able to print 260°C with a heated bed?

I need the heated bed for better adhesion and avoiding wrapping.

 

Thanks for your help!

 

 

 

[gr5 2,172]

It's the power brick.  It's definitely your power brick.  When the UM2 first came out the power bricks had a nice margin of power but the newer bricks are borderline ready to trip.  I would strongly consider trying to find one without the "T" in the name - the second one below:

 

GST220A24-R7B
GS220A24-R7B

 

The one without the T can handle a higher power load.

 

So why does it do it with 60C bed versus 80C bed?  Well the resistance changes quite a bit with temperature.  At the higher temps the bed is higher resistance and less wattage.  At 40C the bed can draw more power.

 

The UM3 uses the same power supply and the same bed but it has some new firmware that calculates the power draw of the bed at different temperatures and has power management that keeps the bed from sucking down too much power when it is still "cold".

 

So another solution is to keep the bed hotter I suppose?

 

Or you could buy a 24V power supply that is MUCH more than 221W.  Maybe a 250W or 300W supply but you might have to cut the cable from your existing supply and solder it onto the new supply.  But it's worth it.

 

Oh!!  Another solution is to get the tinker firmware.  It has a power management feature.  Set the bed to 160W, the nozzle to 35W and the budget to 170W.  This will keep the bed from going to full power at the same time the nozzle is at full power.  For example if the nozzle is on full power the software will assume it's using 35 of the 170W budget and that leaves 170-35 or 135 watts and since you told the software the bed is 160W it will not power it up more than 135/160 or 84% max when the nozzle is on.  But when you are initially heating up the bed and the nozzle heater is off it will assume the bed is 160W and the budget is 170W so there will be no power limiting and it will apply full power.

 

tinker marlin here:

https://github.com/TinkerGnome/Ultimaker2Marlin/releases

 

 

 

[3dDruckIng 0]

Wow thank you gr5 for that detailed answer, the "why" is solved, I checked my power brick "GST220A24-R78"....

 

But I am a bit disappointed from Ultimaker when they really changed to a less powerfull power brick with a clear disadvantage, because the specs say clearly: 

Nozzle temperature

 180 °C to 260 °C

Build plate

50 °C to 100 °C heated glass build plate

https://ultimaker.com/en/products/ultimaker-2-plus/specifications

So it should be possible to print 260°C Nozzle temperature and 50°C build plate? Ultimaker?

 

So my options are:

1. Insist that my UM2+ should be able to print with my configuration:
   • Ultimaker should change theirs specs or should solve the problem with a firmware update?
2. Get the tinker firmware 
3. Try a higher bet temperature? But I need it in the range of 40-50°C....
4. Buy a new 24V power supply  >250: not an option for me because I use my UM2+ in the advertised range

So I will start with #1: Ultimaker Team? 

 

Thanks in advance

 

[gr5 2,172]

Well the GST has some nice features that the GS doesn't have.  I totally forget what they are, but when someone told me I thought, "oh - well I'd probably switch over myself if I worked t Ultimaker and was in charge...".

 

 

Quote

1. Buy a new 24V power supply  >250: not an option for me because I use my UM2+ in the advertised range

 

I don't understand why this isn't an option for you.  Just to be clear about how power supplies work - the power supply will supply 24V steady no matter what happens - except if the UM tries to draw MORE than 221 Watts.  So if you got say a 300 watt supply then it would also supply 24V steady just fine.

 

The wattage stamped on the supply is the *maximum*.  It's the capability.  Not the amount it puts out necessarily at any given moment.

 

Anyway - I'd go with option 2 because I'm too cheap to spend another $100 or 100 euros on a big supply like that.

 

Also if you want to talk to customer support - this is really not the best place.  Start with your reseller.

 

[3dDruckIng 0]

8 hours ago, gr5 said:

I don't understand why this isn't an option for you.

 

Because I have to pay for it 

 

8 hours ago, gr5 said:

Also if you want to talk to customer support - this is really not the best place.  Start with your reseller.

 

I will contact my reseller, but it seems to be a known issue, so Ultimaker should fix the problem for everyone (with a firmware update?).

[SandervG 1,521]

Hi, we had to switch to an alternative power supply because from February 2016 we were no longer allowed to sell power supply units in the US with an energy efficiency level below level VI. That is why we had to switch to the power supply GST with energy efficiency level VI. It should not bring any difficulties to the table by default though, even though the power it produces is slightly lower. 

One thing that could make life more difficult for a power supply is when it is trying to heat up, or maintain a temperature, is when the fans are trying to cool it down at the same time. You could help by not enabling the fans to turn on full power on the second layer, if this is the case. You can gradually let it start in Cura setting: regular fan speed at height. 

 

At the same time I've sent your feedback to our firmware team, perhaps they can use your feedback to further optimize the power budget. 

 

[gr5 2,172]

On 1/4/2018 at 4:04 AM, 3dDruckIng said:

Because I have to pay for it

Oh.  Good reason.  Well I would go for the tinker Marlin option then.  It's got a lot of great features - once you try tinker Marlin you will never want to go back.  Features like "resume failed print".