Infinite Material Solutions: Aquasys

[willryan3 4]

Hello,

I recently got this great (in theory) material that will print with my high temp nylon and can dissolve up to 6x faster than PVA. Since I have been using nylon I know the effects of moisture and dry them out before each trial but it seems I can never get the Aquasys dry enough. I continually have stringing and many problems with it not sticking to layers of itself or layers of the nylon. Again, really great product but am needing some more information on it.

Thanks, Will

Edited April 29, 2020 by willryan3

[SandervG 1,521]

Hi @willryan3, thank you for your post. Good that you dry before you use it, that is important. Can you elaborate on how you dry it, and for how long approximately? Do you keep it stored in a dry environment, like in the Material Station, or a bag with silica packs? 

[willryan3 4]

3 hours ago, SandervG said:

Hi @willryan3, thank you for your post. Good that you dry before you use it, that is important. Can you elaborate on how you dry it, and for how long approximately? Do you keep it stored in a dry environment, like in the Material Station, or a bag with silica packs? 

Thank you for your response. I have been using the PrintDry oven and heating at its' highest temp for 4 hours prior to a print with it. As far as storing I use the same bag it came in with a few silica packs. Would a material like this need to be concealed during the print also? My area for printing has a humidity between 20-30%.

Thanks Will

[Nicko_Airbus 2]

On 4/30/2020 at 8:49 AM, willryan3 said:

Thank you for your response. I have been using the PrintDry oven and heating at its' highest temp for 4 hours prior to a print with it. As far as storing I use the same bag it came in with a few silica packs. Would a material like this need to be concealed during the print also? My area for printing has a humidity between 20-30%.

Thanks Will

 Did you get better results ? I have the same issues with Aquasys and my printer (ultimaker S5 Pro Bundle). I wonder what we should change to get better prints. 

 

Any Feedback ? @willryan3 @SandervG

[SandervG 1,521]

On 4/13/2021 at 10:39 PM, Nicko_Airbus said:

 Did you get better results ? I have the same issues with Aquasys and my printer (ultimaker S5 Pro Bundle). I wonder what we should change to get better prints. 

 

Any Feedback ? @willryan3 @SandervG

 

Hi @Nicko_Airbus thank you for your message. Apologies for my late response. I was quite occupied with the organising and contributing during the Ultimaker Transformation Summit. Can you explain what issues you are experiencing, and can you elaborate a little bit more on how you use the material in combination with the material station?

 

For example, do you dry it before it goes into the material station? It does a great job keeping it dry, but it might be more difficult in getting it dry if it contained too much moisture when you load it in the material station. 

[Nicko_Airbus 2]

Since the first time I received it (in a box and sealed bag (I think)) I put it in the material station. Every now and then, the filament brakes in the bodwen tube, sometimes It doesn't stick to the other layers and and some stringing.

 

I just had the same problem with my ultimaker natural PVA. Printing .3mm high layers at 35 mm/s at 220C. Other settings are as suggested by cura...

[Dim3nsioneer 557]

On 4/29/2021 at 8:03 PM, Nicko_Airbus said:

Every now and then, the filament brakes in the bodwen tube

 

In the Bowden tube indeed? Not in the main feeder? What does your S5 show on the side panel, an Ultibot or the current Ultimaker logo (U)?

[Nicko_Airbus 2]

On 5/1/2021 at 7:51 AM, Dim3nsioneer said:

 

In the Bowden tube indeed? Not in the main feeder? What does your S5 show on the side panel, an Ultibot or the current Ultimaker logo (U)?

 I don't know if it happens in the material station or in the bowden tube. I see the logo, not the robot

[kevinmoore1337 4]

I'm having them same issue with aquasys in s5 pro bundle with robot on the side. it breaks in the bowden tube after the feeder.

[SandervG 1,521]

Hi @Nicko_Airbus and @kevinmoore1337, thank you for your message. 

I would like to ask you to submit a ticket to us via our ticketing system, linking to this thread or describing the issue you have with PVA/filament breaking in your material station. We probably have a solution for you. 

 

Hope this helps, have a great day!

[Trlby 0]

I have had my S5 Bundle for about  6 weeks now, and seeing how easily the Aquasys 120 can break, I worried my office was too humid, and maybe the Material Station was overwhelmed. I do have AC in my office but it's on the second floor of an old building and the factory floor does not have AC.  I did have early issues with both the Air Manager and Material Station not always working consistently.

 

Anyway I decided the best thing to do was to verify that the Material Station was working correctly. I purchased this from Amazon https://tinyurl.com/y4f83npe  It's Bluetooth and at $15 US it's a bargain. I hang the lanyard over the top of the glass Door well out of the way of the Material Reels. Well I must say for $15 it's a gem of a product. It's very accurate, and it gives me peace of mind when running overnight prints.

[rachael7 73]

Did you ever sort this problem? I'm not having stringing issues and my material has stayed in the Material Station since opening the bag, so I don't think it's a moisture issue, but I just cannot get the AquaSys to stick to the UM Polycarbonate, no matter what I try.

[TimonR 21]

Hi @rachael7,

 

So you're trying to print UM PC with Aquasys120 as support right?

We've seen that printing Aquasys120 with PC on top generally works fine, the other way around (printing Aquasys on PC again) seems rather difficult indeed. 

Could be worth looking into support floor settings to see if you get better results?

Specifically look at support bottom distance and support floor settings, those should influence adhesion of aquasys on PC.

 

Hope this helps!

[rachael7 73]

58 minutes ago, TimonR said:

Could be worth looking into support floor settings to see if you get better results?

Specifically look at support bottom distance and support floor settings, those should influence adhesion of aquasys on PC.

Thanks for the reply. Yes, that is the trouble I'm having, the same as you found. I did adjust support floor settings, quite a bit. Bottom distance=0, support floor density=100%, support floor pattern=several tried, support floor flow rate=110%, AquaSys temp=245-255. The best I managed was tenuous adhesion that fails before the part can finish. Any other thoughts? Thanks again!

[TimonR 21]

Hmm, those would also be setttings I'd try to optimize - but unfortunately with no succes.

 

Did it occur only with PC transparant and not with PC Black?
(FYI: UM PC black and white are impact-modified versions of PC, while the PC transparant is only PC - so there might be a difference there on material level).

 

Another thought (which we have no experience with whatsoever): modify the top surface of the PC part. So maybe with a different pattern top surface?

 

Related to that but more complicated: modify your model so you actually have interlocking between the PC bottom and Aquasys printed on top? 

A bit like this research of Tim Kuipers (UM / TuDelft researcher) but then in Z (instead of XY) - see figure 11. Here he managed to do a dual extrusion print with Tough PLA and PP - two materials which are also kind of incompatible.
https://pure.tudelft.nl/ws/portalfiles/portal/103402631/1_s2.0_S2214860421006424_main.pdf

[rachael7 73]

It is black PC, haven't tried clear yet.  Thanks for the link to that surface modification.  I don't think it's right for this application, but it is definitely a clever idea that I will keep in the quiver for other uses!

[glx 26]

Is it possible to get a 0.1mm profile for the Aquasys 120 material to make it working in combination with a AA 0.25 Printcore as build material hotend?

[TimonR 21]

@glx Best to reach out to the material supplier themselves with those requests, they make the profiles for their materials on Ultimaker printers. Maybe also specify which printer, printcore and layer height.

See here for contact information: https://marketplace.ultimaker.com/app/cura/materials/InfiniteMaterialSolutions/AquaSys120

 

Hope this helps!

[rachael7 73]

10 hours ago, TimonR said:

@glx Best to reach out to the material supplier themselves with those requests, they make the profiles for their materials on Ultimaker printers. Maybe also specify which printer, printcore and layer height.

See here for contact information: https://marketplace.ultimaker.com/app/cura/materials/InfiniteMaterialSolutions/AquaSys120

 

Hope this helps!

I second this advice. I don't know if they'll have the answer or not, but when I finally got through to the right person, Sam Dickenson, she was very helpful and willing to discuss things with me.  She seems to do most of the profile work there, they do test on UM machines, and she knows her stuff.  You might start by asking for her.

[thezizizapiol 0]

interesting information

[jirodriguez72 18]

My local Ultimaker reseller had a solution that has really helped us with using Aquasys120. We were having issues with it breaking constantly in the bowden tube just before the print head. Come to find out it was not liking the hot chamber (we print primarily with CF+PC and CF+PA) - the time it spent in the bowden tube from the back of the chamber to the print head was making it brittle. So we purchased some round foam insulation and cut a length that covers the section of bowden tube that is inside of the print chamber. Ever since then we have not had break issues during the print! I will also say after each print when you unload the material the last two feet or so will be brittle - I bend it and if it snaps I keep working my way back until I get to material that does not snap. Then dry it and store it in a vacuum bag for your next print.

[rachael7 73]

2 hours ago, jirodriguez72 said:

So we purchased some round foam insulation and cut a length that covers the section of bowden tube that is inside of the print chamber. Ever since then we have not had break issues during the print!

 

This is fabulous information, thank you! I take it no problems with the insulation impeding movement of the head? Could you share a link to the insulation you used? I've never seen any that small and wouldn't even know where to start looking. Thanks!

[jirodriguez72 18]

6 hours ago, rachael7 said:

 

This is fabulous information, thank you! I take it no problems with the insulation impeding movement of the head? Could you share a link to the insulation you used? I've never seen any that small and wouldn't even know where to start looking. Thanks!

Sure, this is the stuff we used URBEST Pipe Insulation Tubing 1/4" x 3/8" Heat Preservation Insulated 6ft Length Handle Grips (6x9mm) https://a.co/d/elpuzxG . We lightly zip tied it to the stiff guide piece that the bowden tube was clipped to ( you have to remove the clips). That keeps it from flopping around as the print head moves about. Feel free to PM me if you need further information or pictures.

[rachael7 73]

2 minutes ago, jirodriguez72 said:

Sure, this is the stuff we used URBEST Pipe Insulation Tubing 1/4" x 3/8"

 

Awesome, thanks again!

[jirodriguez72 18]

Here are some pictures of how I attached the insulation to the bowden tube. I left a little bit of exposed bowden tube just before the print head so I could see the filament as it loaded, and I just left the clips attached to the stiffener but slid them down by the print head to get them out of the way as I was lightly zip tying the insulation.

 

Like I said this has really helped prevent the Aquasys120 from getting "baked" by the heat in the chamber, becoming brittle, and breaking in the bowden tube right before the print head. I have the hot end set to 240 °C for the Aquasys and that seems to work really well - occasionally there might be a tiny bit of extra oozing, but nothing to bad.

 

As you can see on this print there are a few tiny bits of wispy stringing, but nothing major. I also find with gyroid it really cuts down on the stringing and failed supports if you put one or two walls around your supports - that's why the surface is closed and smooth. But the walls are thin enough that they dissolve quickly letting water into the rest of the area without much delay.

 

Hopefully this will help some of you with this support material - I like it, it has become my go to support material since I am usually printing at 265° and above, and usually need dissolvable supports.

 

Johnny R.