Build plate crash at end of print.

[wcorbit721 0]

We started having an issue with our UMS5, whereas the build plate is dislodged to the right, at the end of the print.

We observed the following:

 

At the end of the print, the printer head moves all the way over to the left to purge a little material out and cool down the left side print core (i believe).

At the same time, the bed raises to a higher point.

After the left side is cooled, the printer head moves over to the right side to purge and cool down the other printer core.  During the move to the right, the bed stays raised and the printer head collides with the printed part.

 

Any ideas what might have caused this, or how to resolve?

[gr5 2,265]

What?  That's crazy. 

1) What version of firmware do you have on the printer (you can see it in the maintenance menu on the front of the printer). 

2) Could you please post both the ufp file and the project file here? 

3) Do you print using USB flash or through digital factory?

 

I'm wondering if you have something wrong with your printer profile.  For #2 project file (which will include your model - I hope it's okay to publish) do "file" "save project as".  For the #3 ufp file hopefully it's still on your flash drive so you can send it to us - a ufp that definitely has the issue.

 

By the way at the end of the print it should RETRACT.  Not purge.  It cools down both cores to a specific temperature.  When it reaches that temperature it retracts.  This keeps the nozzle cleaner and the shape of the filament cleaner and it makes it easier to remove a core or to remove the filament later without having to heat things up.  It should not move the head around while doing any of this.

 

[Nosybottle 9]

I've recently had the same thing happen, except it just broke the print off the bed. When the print head moves to the unloading position the bed is raised at the same time and the nozzle can hit the printed part from above or hit it with guide rods when moving to unload from the second core.

 

This raising of the bed doesn't happen every time, and so far I haven't figured out what makes it happen. Firmware 7.0.2.0 for me.

 

With material station it extrudes a little material while cooling down before pulling the filament to the parked position. This is done on the left for core 1 and on the right for core 2 (same as loading filament), so if both are used it moves to the other side of the bed at some point when unloading.

[Dim3nsioneer 558]

If you guys suspect the firmware doing something strange suddenly, try a Digital Factory Reset. It does reset the Digital Factory (so you would have to reconnect the printer, sorry) but it seems also to act as some kind of soft reset for the firmware.

[Super_paulie 13]

yep, we get this every now and then. Usually destroys the rubber around the nozzles, often snaps the job and pushes the glass way off. We had a thread about it not so long back. Seems to happen at random no matter what firmware we use.

 

Quote

 

 

[gr5 2,265]

Okay I understand better now.  With the material station (which I don't have - I just have a plain S5) it does a cold pull for each core and it lowers the right core before doing the right core (which should be unnecessary). 

 

The bug is that the bed is all the way up when it does this final procedure and when it goes to swap to the other core it hits the part.  People who don't have a MS don't have this problem because it doesn't do the cold pull (it does a kind of warm pull).

 

@CarloK  @robinmdh - I know where to submit Cura bugs but where do these 3 people submit a firmware bug so that the firmware team looks into it?

 

Should they do:

support.ultimaker.com  and click "submit a request" in the top right corner?

 

Or is there a more direct/better way?

 

[Nosybottle 9]

I guess I could contact our reseller who provides support, but as it is I don't really have much to tell them. So far I've seen it hit the print only two times. If only I remembered which prints it happened with so I could try to print the same gcode again and see what happens.

 

Regarding the lowering of the second core, I don't quite remember how high it sits, but perhaps it is done so that you never extrude from the second print core in the high position to prevent possible extruded plastic curling upwards and going through the hole in the silicon cover and up above it? But as I said, I don't quite remember how much the nozzle stays in contact with the cover in the up position

[Super_paulie 13]

I've had a job that hits/destroys the part on finishing, but when I print the exact same file again the problem doesn't happen... 

[Dim3nsioneer 558]

15 hours ago, Nosybottle said:

I guess I could contact our reseller who provides support, but as it is I don't really have much to tell them.

 

Logfiles might help as they could contain a hint why it is driving to a wrong location. The quicker you download them after it happened, the better.

[Nosybottle 9]

Ahh.. I didn't think of that. I'll try to remember the next time I see it happen. Thanks.

[gr5 2,265]

So it's common for the print head to knock a part off the bed in the middle of a print - it's a bit complicated but you can have the part higher than the currently printed layer on certain kinds of overhangs - the plastic sticks up.  So this is a boring, old problem fixed with better adhesion techniques.

 

But much more interesting is if the part comes off the bed at the END of the print - particularly hard enough that the glass slides out of the clips.  This sounds like a firmware bug (possibly a cura bug but I doubt it).

 

Regarding going to the lift switch maneuver.  There are gcodes to change a core temperature without doing the lift switch (you add T0 or T1 in the middle of the gcode).  But the only way I know to move the feeder is to do a gcode T0 or T1 by itself which does the lift switch maneuver.  Some printers let you control each feeder independently and simultaneously with gcodes but the firmware on the S5 I believe doesn't let you so I think you have to go over to the lift switch to do a cold pull for both cores.

 

For me I'm pretty sure it always moves the bed down to the very bottom at the end of a print.  Before it messes with the retraction on each print head.  But I don't have the material station so the procedure is a little different.

[CarloK 205]

On 5/4/2022 at 3:40 PM, gr5 said:

 

@CarloK  @robinmdh - I know where to submit Cura bugs but where do these 3 people submit a firmware bug so that the firmware team looks into it?

 

Should they do:

support.ultimaker.com  and click "submit a request" in the top right corner?

 

Or is there a more direct/better way?

support.ultimaker.com is the correct method for submitting (firmware) bugs. Note that the "submit a request" button is not available on the front page, you'll have to click one page further.

[CarloK 205]

@wcorbit721The printer should not behave in the manner you posted here. In order to look into this we need more information from you. Could you please answer @gr5's questions here above? Without that information we can do nothing.

[Paul_Inspire3D 0]

Had this issue with a customer recently and update of the machine firmware from 7.0.2 to 7.0.3 seems to have cleared the error and the machine is back printing as normal! 

[Mandersson 0]

Hi guys! 

My first post here

 

Any solution to this issue? Had the exact same thing happening to me twice the last two nights

S5 Pro Bundle 

V 7.0.3

Cura 5.0.0  (changed back from 5.1.0 due to support material issues)

 

Thanks

[gr5 2,265]

I'd go to support.ultimaker.com and in the top right corner there is text that says "submit a request".  Click that and fill it all out.  Call it a firmware bug.  Refer to this topic on the forum.  The workaround is to not use the material station (retract all filaments from the station, power down, unplug electrical connections to MS, put spool holders on the back of the S5, power back up). 

 

Anyway if you submit it this way as a firmware bug it should go right to Ultimaker employees who can fix this and bypass your reseller.  Make sure to let them know that multiple people with the material station have this problem.

[gr5 2,265]

firmware 7.0.4 just came out!  maybe that will fix the issue?  I'd still contact support.

[Ultiflow 0]

I had this issues 3 times over the last week, except the build plate is pushed totally on the left at the end. I can't identify the reason but what has been said about the purge is a potential good explanation. I just made a print with Material 2, and I find my plate displace.

 

The push on the engine must be strong to do this, the build plate seems even damaged.

 

Firmware 7.1.0 is installed.

[gr5 2,265]

Did the print complete before the issue?  There are 2 issues and it's important to be sure you have the firmware issue and not the other issue.

[Ultiflow 0]

Yes, all pieces were well printed.

 

Maybe I recall once one piece have been removed from the plate meaning that the head may have push on them.

 

Some clues

 

1. On the last print, I had a message of buildplate elevation fail (which I did not had like this before) I just pressed cancel and restarted the print.

 

2. On the last print, I did print material on the 2nd head, with pieces only made of the material 2, but I had a skirt made of two on the plate initially.

 

My goal is to film the ending situation, so I go at the printer to film.

 

I have the log of what I think is the end of the last print, but I am not sure it helps.

[gr5 2,265]

@CarloK??  Is this a known issue?  He has the S5 pro bundle.

[Ultiflow 0]

It did it again without big push of the plate, probably because the piece was small.

 

And 1. Did not happened, not previous error message.

 

The piece was printed well then it purges #2, then it seems that it went hit the right front with some engine forcing. 

 

And then, it goes back, left and front while being to low and scratches the thin object (something like 1 cm tall)

 

 

I have a video of it, but can't upload that format here. In the video you can hear the sound of the head hitting the piece.

 

By the way, it was the same as #2. Only parts on feed #2, with skirt of #1&#2 only.

 

When there is two colors parts, purge is made on #1 first and when only #2, it does #2 first. But, maybe this is not the reason.

Edited September 6, 2022 by Ultiflow
Added more details

[gr5 2,265]

I think maybe you have to calibrate the lift switch?  But I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to say.  Please post the video on youtube or google drive or somewhere and post a link to the video in this topic.

[Ultiflow 0]

Sometimes the build plate is so high that it pushes the plate or the piece on it. If you think it could be a calibration maybe, but is it not calibrated at each start somehow ?

 

 

Edited September 7, 2022 by Ultiflow

[gr5 2,265]

I really really really need to see that video otherwise I'm talking out of my butt.  However I'll continue talking out of my butt:  The way the right core goes up and down is using something called the "lift switch".  If not calibrated the right core can be down when it is supposed to be up and vice versa.  If it's down when you are supposed to be printing with the left core then the right core will hit all kinds of objects which can push the glass right out of the printer (pushing open those double doors)  and onto the floor in front of the printer or it can push the glass left or right.  I'm not convinced this is the problem as without seeing the video I'm not sure what you have been saying at all really.

 

If you have gmail then google will host your video no problem.  They call it "google drive".  Or you can sign up for a youtube account and there is an "upload video" button and they really want to make it easy for you.  Or there are hundreds of other hosting services but unfortunately not Ultimaker.