New kind of printer plate to replace tape

[Nicolinux 288]

Hi,

just read about a new kind of plate that is designed to replace painters tape. Might not fit the UM1 print area, but it is an interesting concept anyway:

 

• http://3dprinterninja.com/ninja-printer-plates/
  

 

[aaronalai 2]

A pretty interesting idea indeed, given that it's some type of polymer that is repeatedly heated to print on, and flexed to remove the print, I wonder what type of life expectancy the plate has. Very cool idea though, it looks like it mitigates the need for brim as well.

It looks like the qestion is already in their FAQ:

https://3dprinterninja.com/ninja-printer-plate/

 

[IRobertI 520]

"The laminate skins are produced in a unique process that maintains precise thickness control, resulting in a very flat plate for printing"

But it warps when used on a heated bed and they recommend to alternate the side you print on...

 

[duesentrieb 0]

Hi,

I have something like this mounted to the heatbed of my UM1. http://www.mtplus.de/3.html The size of 230x230mm is perfect for an UM. I print at 50°C, PLA sticks very good, after finishing the print, the plate cools down and the print releases itself at a temperature of about 40°C. If this is not fast enough, I can loosen the plate and bend it, the print simply pops off. The surface of the prints is perfect, much better than with blue tape. Maybe even better than with glas, because you don´t need gluestick, hairspray or anything else.

In the current setup this plate has only one disadvantage, it´s flexible and because I attached it directly to the heated bed it is not 100% plain. So maybe I have to add an Aluminium plate between the plate and the heated bed. But this will result in longer heating times, but will also spread the heat all-over.

If anybody is interested, I will take a picture of this setup tomorrow.

Philip

 

[calinb 11]

Based on my BKM (Best Known Methods) I don't know that there's any room for improvement. When I need optimum (usually perfect) adhesion, I use the following surfaces.

PLA:

Hot-swappable glass plates on warm (~70C) precision aluminum Mic-6 bed plate. With a little heat, it's very convenient and easy-peasy to get perfect adhesion with PLA. When cool, parts just pop off by themselves Though not essential for PLA, heat is so compelling I can't imagine not having a heated bed for PLA!

ABS:

ABS "juiced" Kapton tape stuck to hot-swappable glass plates over hot (~120C) precision aluminum Mic-6 bed plate. I use a heated build "tent/chamber" and ambient air temp of up to ~65C. The control of temps, fan, and overall process can be very complex and trying, if perfect adhesion of thick and blocky parts is desired. For printing anything other than very small and thin parts in ABS, heat for the bed and build chamber is essential. Just look at the Stratasys patents!

Nylon:

1/16" Garolite LE or CE (LE or sanded CE is best) bonded to aluminum Mic-6 bed plate using water soluble wood glue. The thicker Garolite is often badly warped from the manufacturer--too warped to machine and use without the Mic-6 plate. The Garolite can be renewed, when necessary (not very often) by soaking the plate in a bucket of water. The 1/16" sheets are flexible and bond to provide a reasonably flat surface, which can be further leveled by sanding on a large plate of thick glass (inherently flat). For the best adhesion, a glue stick can be applied to the Garolite and blotted with a terry cloth before it dries to provide a little texture to the glue surface, improving its performance. A wet sponge works well to redistribute the glue between print runs. I have not found heat to be useful with nylon.

 

[ataraxis 51]

Hey Duesentrieb, i AM interested!

 

[skint 61]

The guy that has designed those ninja plates is a contact on my linkedin page, maybe I`ll ask for samples

 

[ataraxis 51]

nice! do it - and report to us please !

 

[jameshs 42]

Why would you move away from cheap glass and PVA solution.

Works well for me with PLA no hot bed.

I do still use blue tape for XT

James

 

[calinb 11]

A heated bed for PLA is very compelling, because you can use hot swap glass and there's no muss, no fuss, and it is very fast to remove the plate and start a new print on a new plate. As soon as the plate cools, the parts fall right off!

 

[Nicolinux 288]

Except that you have to re-level the z-stage again after swapping the glass plate...

 

[yzorg 9]

interesting.

we should make some experiments with a diy solution of this sandwiched glassfiber plate idea.

there are a lot of glassfiber wallpapers with interesting surface properties and textures. also this could come in pretty cheap if we find a good solution to laminate them to a flexible but super flat base material. (i remember good old wood glue as good sticking amplifier)

of course i think of having multiple plates to swap.

 

[wayne-huthmaker 0]

Hi,

Since this thread began in January, I continued developing these flexible printer plates. My business is now called http://printinz.com and I will be offering plates to fit the UM2 in June. The latest design is slightly thinner, flatter and much more thermally stable. I solved the warping issues from earlier by making some material changes.

I sent one to a user (chrisp) on this forum so I could make sure it was sized correctly and determine how best to attach it. You can see one of his posts about it http://umforum.ultimaker.com/index.php?/topic/5737-print-plaabs-without-heated-bed/?hl=www.printinz.com. He has more images of things he printed on it http://umforum.ultimaker.com/index.php?/topic/467-post-your-latest-print/page-96?hl=www.printinz.com#entry52127. Turns out it fits perfectly in place of the glass.

You can check out a large PLA print someone did this past week on a MakerBot machine on my https://www.facebook.com/printinz?ref=bookmarks.

Most people are skeptical about these plates until they give one a try... then they love them. They just make printing easier. There are so many variables to contend with to get that first layer to stick just right. My experience is that these plates are just more forgiving and it mitigates some of the sensitivity of the other variables.

Check them out and please let me know if you have any questions. I'm always trying to make them better.

Wayne

 

[wayne-huthmaker 0]

A pretty interesting idea indeed, given that it's some type of polymer that is repeatedly heated to print on, and flexed to remove the print, I wonder what type of life expectancy the plate has. Very cool idea though, it looks like it mitigates the need for brim as well.

It looks like the qestion is already in their FAQ:

https://3dprinterninja.com/ninja-printer-plate/

Aaron,

I still don't know the life expectancy of these because no one has reported back to me that they have "used it up". Several people have ordered additional ones or different sizes for their other machines, but none as replacements (since selling them began in February). I had one user report over 200 hours of use and still going strong. The materials are all rated to temperatures much higher than what the plates will typically see (~100C or less). They are also all flexible regardless of the temperature.

Let me know if you have other questions. I appreciate the interest.

Wayne

PRINTinZ.com

 

[Nicolinux 288]

I find the idea cool too. But still, what about taking the plate out after every print and re-leveling the bed. Not sure if it is worth the trouble.

 

[jhertzberg 19]

I'm using Murat's 3-point levelling for Ultimaker with magnetic ball bearings V2 (http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:84754 I feel dirty just posting a Thingiverse link now.) I find that I don't need to re-level, since the plate returns so consistently to the same place.

 

[Daid 306]

Interesting... what would be the cost for a 1000 pieces for the UM2? (Ok, just kidding... for now)

 

[wayne-huthmaker 0]

I find the idea cool too. But still, what about taking the plate out after every print and re-leveling the bed. Not sure if it is worth the trouble.

 

Many people are able to lift their print off the plate without removing it, but if you need to remove it and flex it a bit, then I find I don't need to relevel when I put it back on the machine. They are fairly rigid - the newer version is stiffer than what you see in the

.

 

[eldrick 65]

Except that you have to re-level the z-stage again after swapping the glass plate...

Not normally true. I have two UM glass plates on my UM2, and swap them between every print without re-leveling.

I suppose if you were printing .06mm layers it could just possibly be an issue, but glass is pretty consistent in its thickness - if I mike the two pieces, they are well within the error tolerance for build-plate leveling, given that the UM2 jog-wheel seems to raise/lower the plate about .1mm at a time.

 

[eldrick 65]

I got in on a GeckoTek buildplate for UM2, with magnetic attachment to a replacement heated aluminum plate. Should be interesting, as magnets don't tend to do well at high temps.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/geckotek3d/geckotek-3d-printer-build-plate%20on%20kickstarter,%C2%A0

It will also be impossible to alternate the side used with the magnetic attachment, so I'll be really curious to see how well it actually works.