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Acetone Finishing on PLA

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Wouldn't it also help to use some kind of vibration when you just created the cast so all the air goes out on top?

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

It was a failure, I simply couldn't get the print out of the mold without 45 minutes of struggle and total destruction. the gaps between the letters proved too difficult.

the print came out great, the mold is in the bin.

If anyone has any advice on how to release plastic from a platinum mold it would be much appreciated! especially when the mold is deep. Cutting it in several places dint even help much. the inside of the g and between the t and m and g was also hard to get out.

Looks like its gonna have to be a boring extruded version....shame.

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Posted (edited) · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Hey my friend :)

so i dont heard anything reagarding my videos, so i testet more....

this part is good!

Because the smothing process was not so good as a 0,04 print i made now a test with a print  of 0,025 which takes far to long with 40h, but it was a test...

sanding, aceton brushing, waiting 1h, sanding, acetoning, warting 1min, brushing without aceton, sanding grid 800, aceton brushing ---->

it looks now:

foto2711168xdj05gfer_thumb.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Y2vu9if9tg&feature=em-upload_owner

OK because i dont have any colored pha i used now the airbrush to see more details

and the part looks now like:

foto271116sl5jb26mgx.jpg

here you see a little lines on the flat part

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and here in those deeper parts, where no sanding was possible

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next step is to use filler and see what happend

Is this effect the same to yours, or is yours even more better?

I need thos effevt with 0,04 or 0,06 prints, 0,025 takes to long :)

Edited by Guest

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

I'm working stupid hours at the moment, when i get home i just want to sleep. Ive done loads of printing of mainly the same thing, but all in 0.04 and i have got no horizontal lines at all. I get vertical stepper lines, thats my main issue. If i can eliminate those, then i will have no lines.

0.025 is crazy in my opinion unless your object is ULTRA detailed, as with acetone smoothing on the 0.04 I s perfectly fine for me. Ill post a bunch of photos soon, Its just Ive sent stuff off for vacuum moulds as silicone platinum moulds are just not cutting it with the clear resin I'm using. the fine sanded surface comes out matte (quite cool but not what i want) , and i want it shiny, without having to polish my model to a shine, but keeping all the sharp edges of the text. We'll see.

you really should not be needing the 0.025 but hey, if it works for you! do it. I personally hate long print times.

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Hello Cloakfiend: a way to release complex shapes from a silicon mould might be to use a thinner mould. Like they do when casting human bodies. A thin layer of silicone can be removed like a blanket. But then you need to design and 3D-print a tight fitting hard shell too, that can be opened, and with register marks, so you can fit it together exactly. Otherwise the silicon mould does not keep its shape. This also saves you a lot of money on silicone, because you need far less.

Google for Youtube videos on mould making and casting.

Another thing that helps, is to spray the model with silicon mould-release spray before casting the mould. Then it does not stick so much. But complex shapes with such deep and long undercuts like that logo will always be very difficult to remove. A very flexible silicone with high resistance to shearing may help (they come in different hardnesses), but they are dimensionally less stable, so then you definitely need a hard shell around the silicone.

You could also 3D-print some "cores" (sort of long pilars or pins) that fit into the eyes and holes of your model. In such a way that after pouring and curing the silicone, you can first pull out these cores. Then the silicone comes loose, and is easier to remove. (If I find time, I will make a drawing to illustrate this.)

Be sure to vacuum the silicone after mixing, pour it in the mould in a thin stream from some height, and tap or shake the model afterwards. All this helps to prevent and remove bubbles.

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

I'm working stupid hours at the moment, when i get home i just want to sleep. Ive done loads of printing of mainly the same thing, but all in 0.04 and i have got no horizontal lines at all. I get vertical stepper lines, thats my main issue. If i can eliminate those, then i will have no lines.

0.025 is crazy in my opinion unless your object is ULTRA detailed, as with acetone smoothing on the 0.04 I s perfectly fine for me. Ill post a bunch of photos soon, Its just Ive sent stuff off for vacuum moulds as silicone platinum moulds are just not cutting it with the clear resin I'm using. the fine sanded surface comes out matte (quite cool but not what i want) , and i want it shiny, without having to polish my model to a shine, but keeping all the sharp edges of the text. We'll see.

you really should not be needing the 0.025 but hey, if it works for you! do it. I personally hate long print times.

 

0.025 is more then crazy........ i hate this too!!! but i dont had a good effect on 0.04 print :(

so what do you say to the surface on my photos?

shall i print the some objekt in 0.04 and use transparent red? or better ultramarin blue??? so that i can test the effect better!

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Thanks for the advice! I've read a lot about the thin and thick moulds, but as usual everything is very last minute, Ive asked someone to make 10 moulds for me because i need to now cast them all in one night as the polyester resin takes ages to cure in this crappy cold weather at the moment.

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

for top surfaces you will need to sand. but in my current experience i don't sand before the dip anymore. Im always experimenting to see whats best. I didn't wand any warping so printing with infill and a thicker shell.

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

I will post a bunch of closeups today....threw most of them away as they were mainly failure resin casts, but you do see the polished surface and sides. No lines.

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

OK its finally my weekend. Unfortunately I completely forgot the thermal part of vacuum moulds, with PLA prints, lol.

My master prints got ruined in the process. A few pics. Need to make a few more now.

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Posted (edited) · Acetone Finishing on PLA

OK been doing a lot of testing and am done now, polyester, polyurethane, epoxy, tried them all and the more expensive ones are much more user friendly and tend to cure quicker and less tacky. The transparent dyes I bought were a joke, and were all opaque, so I just ended up using a transparent solvent paint mixed in with the resin. Ended up printing this damn logo out A LOT, so for all those who think I do a lot of sanding to get it smooth you are wrong. I have little patience and hate sanding just as much as the next person. I don't even bother going above 320 thanks to the acetone, so end up with a slight matte finish which i really like, and its easy to polish into a transparent look after being cast anyway. Here are some pics. I've learnt a lot doing this, and event though have failed many attempts, it was worth it.

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Please don't click reply!!!! If you do delete the pics!

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Edited by Guest
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Posted (edited) · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Just cleaned up my printer and re-lubed it and cleaned all the rods after over a years use still with the original PFTE too! Haven't done any atomic pulls in that time either! Im was going to switch out the OB for the original nozzle but I can't be bothered messing with it right now. Ill wait till something starts to fail before i change stuff, I thought the PFTE might be dying but I have switched to a newer CURA finally, and had a few issues with large poly counts on the new one. Im still trying to get the same speeds, but one thing i have noticed is that if you print the first layers just as fast as the rest of the model they are FAR less likely to warp at the edges which is nice, and also the fact i can set just one or two bottom layers is also great. Anyhows just thought id share that, will post some pics soon, maybe a couple vids too, but finding the time to edit my rants down is proving difficult, lol.

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No sanding. Just acetone.

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Edited by Guest
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Posted (edited) · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Here is my next one. Came out great. good ole acetone never lets me down!

There is no better method if you intend to paint or finish your object, and even if there was it would be too destructive. Acetone and PHA colorfabb is the way to go folks, If colorfabb people are reading I'd sure appreciate some filament for all the free advertising, lol.

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Edited by Guest

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

OK been doing a lot of testing and am done now, polyester, polyurethane, epoxy, tried them all and the more expensive ones are much more user friendly and tend to cure quicker and less tacky.

 

So what material did you use in the end for the mold and the final product?

Absolutely love your result !!!

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Thats the neat print above just after a 40 sec acetone dunk.

For the other red glass MTG prints I used Polyurethane mixed with glass dye (to get the red) as transparent dyes were far too opaque. The mold was from addition cure silicon, but i recon i could have used bog standard silicon as I used the more expensive polyurethane which cures far quicker than the polyester (which is the transparent one that you can't use with regular silicon because its too tacky after). the polyester is dirt cheap though 5 litres for like 20 bucks or something, there are loads of brands about but there are only three real different ones including the epoxy as well which works with any silicone, but is the most expensive (but safe to do at home). The polyester ABSOLUTELY STINKS, the polyurethane is better (still bad but it doesn't stink) and Epoxy even better( completely safe).

So basically I used polyurethane and addition cure silicone for the mould. Stained glass paint for the dye to tint the polyurethane as you can't use any dyes that contain water. Some BIRO ink DOES work, but is so impossible to mix to the desired colour you want due to the concentration of it don't even bother unless you are just going use it as is. The green was real nice but the red looked to pinky and went orange when i thinned it out and the back went too purply.

Hope that helps!!!

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Another 40 sec dip might try just 30 or 15 or just even 10 or 5 next as 40 seems excessive compared to my earlier brush on treatments. Had to sand it a touch as I switched off the retraction and it kept on hitting the spill into the walls and it stuck out all over. Wont do that again.

usual before and afters.

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Cloak

What do you know about the Structur3d Tower?

It's a paste extruder you attach to the Ultimaker.

Silicones, clay, polyurethane I'm sure got mentioned. I sat with the guy who pioneered it yesterday for a good few hours - very smart guy in his field which is material sciences - I'm sure you'd have a good conversation with him.

Worth a look at least for you I reckon. Would like to hear your thoughts on it?

http://www.structur3d.io/#discov3ry

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Looks great for cakes and stuff, but considering I've spent the last few weeks perfecting my mold making, I think I'd get cleaner results that way using many materials. This would be very good for icing and sticky materials but not for what I need.

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Ah right fair point.

Yeah he said the icing is good, but some of the silicone stuff he produced was impressive.

I was thinking you said about the silicone molds. But yeah I see your point.

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Cloak

What do you know about the Structur3d Tower?

It's a paste extruder you attach to the Ultimaker.

Silicones, clay, polyurethane I'm sure got mentioned. I sat with the guy who pioneered it yesterday for a good few hours - very smart guy in his field which is material sciences - I'm sure you'd have a good conversation with him.

Worth a look at least for you I reckon. Would like to hear your thoughts on it?

http://www.structur3d.io/#discov3ry

 

You met with Charles? I also met him last year in June, pretty cool guy! And I like what he is doing with his extruder. I have one, haven't had the opportunity to try it but using silicones I can imagine one could make some pretty handy things.

The feeding process took quite some time to get started, but you know.. good things come to those who wait ;)

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Posted (edited) · Acetone Finishing on PLA

just curious, but are the silicon layers smooth or smoothable?

what chemicals even smooth silicon?

Edited by Guest

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

My understanding from the Discov3ry extruder is that it uses regular silicones that you can get at your local hardware store. The downside is that the resolution you can achieve is not the same as with printing PLA. It is much softer and doesn't solidify as fast as PLA. So it will sag a bit more, and I don't think it does retractions very well.

But for more simple shapes like pads, rings, solid shapes, I think it can do a decent job.

Is that what you mean?

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Posted (edited) · Acetone Finishing on PLA

Yes, the resolution. Basically it doesnt look like it does smooth surfaces and that is what Im after, I just printed my biggest face ever for an award and it came out great apart from some slight warping around the eyes, but that is because I had to print it hollow with no supports or infill due to time restrictions. Ill post a pic after I see it finished as it was for a job and I don't have it anymore. Smoothed great too with a 10 second wash.

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Posted · Acetone Finishing on PLA

 

Cloak

What do you know about the Structur3d Tower?

It's a paste extruder you attach to the Ultimaker.

Silicones, clay, polyurethane I'm sure got mentioned. I sat with the guy who pioneered it yesterday for a good few hours - very smart guy in his field which is material sciences - I'm sure you'd have a good conversation with him.

Worth a look at least for you I reckon. Would like to hear your thoughts on it?

http://www.structur3d.io/#discov3ry

 

You met with Charles? I also met him last year in June, pretty cool guy! And I like what he is doing with his extruder. I have one, haven't had the opportunity to try it but using silicones I can imagine one could make some pretty handy things.

The feeding process took quite some time to get started, but you know.. good things come to those who wait ;)

 

Yes that is the guy, top guy!!

And haha yeah the purge can take a while. He said it had a few tweaks that needed making, and it is at a rather experimental stage, but he'd had some good prints from it. I'll get some pictures up.

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