Jump to content
Ultimaker Community of 3D Printing Experts
craftee

Ultimaker 3 upgrade kit

Recommended Posts

So i am an ultimaker 2 owner, and bought the damn thing because ultimaker assured there would be a dual extrusion kit for the UM2. I made a post earlier this year and you guys said that it was not possible to get dual extrusion. so seems like releasing UM3 is a slap to the face of all UM2 owners. that being said, will you release a dual extrusion upgrade kit for UM2 owners?

Edited by Guest
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, there will not be an upgrade kit. And even if there was, you would not want to pay the price, as it would be very expensive because of the amount of parts you would need to replace. As well as the time needed to do all the mods to the mechanics. It's not just a matter of doing a head transplant.

No one is more sorry than Ultimaker that dual extrusion never worked on the UM2. Of course they wanted to release it, that's how they make money. And they tried, they tried very hard and it just never worked well enough to be released (I tested a couple of prototypes and well... it didn't work very well). Yes, it sucks, but would you have been less angry if you got an upgrade that didn't work?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At a glance it looks like an upgrade kit would be relatively easy since the core design of the ultimaker hasnt changed. all the necessary hardware mounting seem to be there, so i dont see what could be so difficult. furthermore, i dont even have the option to even try to upgrade it myself since ultimaker doesnt make the parts available.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i dont even have the option to even try to upgrade it myself since ultimaker doesnt make the parts available.

Indeed I don't think you'd get any UM3 part right now, but in general genuane ultimaker parts are real easy to buy, you can get every single  bit ... and if a part is not listed you look up the itemnumber on the BOM (on github)  and you can still order it...

I don't know any other company doing this so well...

http://www.makerpoint.nl/nl/3d-printen/upgrades-parts/ultimaker/ultimaker-2/

*normally Ultimaker puts the design files and BOM of a machine on github 6 months after release of a machine

Edited by Guest

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted more details in another topic. But it comes down to 2 things:

a) The UM3 was planned as the UM2.1 like... 3 years ago? We really really wanted this as an upgrade. But it's not feasible due to our most important requirement "only release something if it's up to the task"

b) While it looks almost the same from a distance. Almost every component that is worth something has changed. From electronics to printhead.

You are free to collect the right parts and build dual in your UM2 yourself. I know that it can work, but it is a lot of tinkering to get working right. Also, be careful with PVA. We didn't engineer a different hotend for that without a reason.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Basically, we should not reduce al the nice gizzmos of the UM3 just to the dual print. There are tonns of nice things on it, BUT...

To apply just a plain head with core support, but without supporting all the electronics/intelligent features might work with of course a lot of thinkering... So just porting the plain head with the (mechanical?) nozzle lift and "stupid" cores...

maybe a aftermarket option... we will see... :-)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The connection to the board is completely different for the head (it's a single connector) and it communicates over i2c. So you would also need the new control board + the other new board + custom firmware to make up for the differences.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok... understood...

But I meant, jut to use the mechanical setup... and a stupid connector for heater, sensor and fan cables...

I guess if it is possible to mount a e3d on an UMO, it is also possible to port the mechanical parts of the UM3 to it... Worst case change the orientation if the print head or make adaptors to make it work (as for the UM2 head on an UMO).

The electronics and related features of course are to be kicked out... Just a stupid connector for the heater and sensor cables. Heater specs needs to be checked, and the sensor type (PT100 amplifier board from e3d?), but thats something possible...

It´s not about the intelligence I´d like to port, it´s about the basic setup. Everything else can be set via CURA...

Could work, but it´s a lot of thinkering... :-)

And of course, it´s just thinking... only ideas in my weired head :-)

Edited by Guest

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Basically, we should not reduce al the nice gizzmos of the UM3 just to the dual print. There are tonns of nice things on it, BUT...

To apply just a plain head with core support, but without supporting all the electronics/intelligent features might work with of course a lot of thinkering... So just porting the plain head with the (mechanical?) nozzle lift and "stupid" cores...

maybe a aftermarket option... we will see... :-)

 

It might work, but it requires some serious engineering effort, and you will get very sub-optimal results. For example, the location of the switching bay differs from machine to machine, so that needs machine calibration.

Don't expect this from us, else you will be disappointed. We learned from the UMO that having too many different machines out there is a nightmare for support (from both a service side as well from a software side)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't expect this from us, else you will be disappointed. We learned from the UMO that having too many different machines out there is a nightmare for support (from both a service side as well from a software side)

 

Don´t panic, of course, I don´t expect it from Ultimaker :-) You did a great job on it...

It was just a brain game as usual when something new appears and the budget is low...

Nevertheless, understanding the mechanism is the first step...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think that for dual printing, the options from the community (foehnsturm or crema) are much easier to implement and maybe even better suited for an UM2 upgrade. At least i don't see, what the hazzle of porting a UM3 head could offer me over those solutions.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

@BrayChristopher, if you have not already done so, contact your local reseller about buying a rigid spacer and the TFM from the UM2+ instead of swapping to a new PTFE (if you have a non-plus UM2) the next time you need to change it out, it is not very expensive and the new TFM lasts a lot longer.

Edited by Guest

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Indeed I don't think you'd get any UM3 part right now, but in general genuane ultimaker parts are real easy to buy, you can get every single  bit ... and if a part is not listed you look up the itemnumber on the BOM (on github)  and you can still order it...

I don't know any other company doing this so well...

http://www.makerpoint.nl/nl/3d-printen/upgrades-parts/ultimaker/ultimaker-2/

*normally Ultimaker puts the design files and BOM of a machine on github 6 months after release of a machine

 

Well i still cant purchase the new extruder assembly without purchasing the entire kit (which comes with things i dont need). Yes certain replacement parts are available, but other parts are not. I simply want ultimaker to offer the parts individually, thats all

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well i still cant purchase the new extruder assembly without purchasing the entire kit (which comes with things i dont need). Yes certain replacement parts are available, but other parts are not. I simply want ultimaker to offer the parts individually, thats all

 

where you say "extruder assembly" what do you mean? the feeder? I could buy one (in loose parts) from Makerpoint. I think the idea is still that the feeder will become available as an separate assembled part. Any update @SandervG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you contact your reseller you should be able to request just the single feeder. ( I am not convinced buying it in separate parts is the only way to go. I think ready and assembled should also be an option.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi. I'm working with makerbot printers for about 4 years and i can't say that they are the best printers on the market but they are doing the job well, and almost all of the prints are perfect. i can complain about the price and the quality (only 0.1, close source....) but its not the topic. i decided to bought an ultimaker 2 about a year ago because of the quality, upgradability, open source, great look and a hole lot of recommendations. till i bought it i have a lot of problems like under extrusion (tried everything to fix it, maybe its layer skipping (bad bearing)...not sure), material grinding, rough surface and more....

half year later, you announced the um2+ that solved all these problems but i decided to wait till the um3.

i'm and a lot of others bought the um2 because you promised dual extrusion! i really wanna upgrade my printer, and i think that most of the people, will agree to pay around 500-1000$ for a upgrade kit which will solve all the problems(including the annoying fan) and will add dual extrusion, instead of selling they um2 and buying the um3 which will cost more.

the whole ultimaker's community is waiting for that till the um2 announcement and you promised! a lot of times...... so pleas.... work a bit.... i will buy it and im sure that a lot of others will, so do it! im not the only that asked but that's why ultimaker is special, and the first in half of the top 10!!! so dont disappoint us!!! please!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
really wanna upgrade my printer, and i think that most of the people, will agree to pay around 500-1000$ for a upgrade kit

It they did a upgrade kit from UM2 to UM3 it would most certainly not be 500$-1000$... (the UM2+ upgrade kit is 500$, and this upgrade would be substantially more), it would be more along the lines of 2500$ i would guess since so many parts have changed, and it would be a very time consuming install.

I would suggest that you sell your UM2 and get a UM3 instead if you want good dual extrusion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

really wanna upgrade my printer, and i think that most of the people, will agree to pay around 500-1000$ for a upgrade kit

It they did a upgrade kit from UM2 to UM3 it would most certainly not be 500$-1000$... (the UM2+ upgrade kit is 500$, and this upgrade would be substantially more), it would be more along the lines of 2500$ i would guess since so many parts have changed, and it would be a very time consuming install.

I would suggest that you sell your UM2 and get a UM3 instead if you want good dual extrusion.

 

i disagree with you and the ultimaker extrusion upgrade (2 to 2+) is extremely overpriced and its only changing some plastic parts and the extruder.

to upgrade the um2 to um3 you need another stepper (20$-50$), maybe another controller (333$) the head.... (just metal and plastic.... i have the fans....maybe 120$) sticker????(5$) and the plastic part that change the height of the extruder(15$).... i don't need the smart spool holder but if they want 100$ everything around 700$ with some profit it should be less than 1000$ and i overpriced everything.....

it's not 2500$ and it's possible to do it so why not?!!!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bit funny how people look at printers so different as to other products :)

I don't really understand why people think a products price is made up only by it's parts? Have you any idea what the components price of a high-end phone is compared to it's retail price? Do you write letters to Apple/Samsung why you can't get there products for the components price? Don't think so ......

  • Like 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, Apple products are not open source, so I guess people wrongly assume that Ultimaker is not a common company.

Ultimaker's parts are well made but selling a replacement UM2 glass bed at 30 euros where you can have the same thing in a hardware store for 3 euros is a bit strange.

Of course we pay for R&D, though an UM2 replacement motherboard at 350 euros is quite harsh.

Edited by Guest

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Melka: Can you really have for 3 euros in a French hardware store a borosilicate glass with exact the right dimensions for your Ultimaker (length, width and thickness) with rounded edges (not only rounded in x-y direction but also in z direction) with a 'attention warm' warning sticker on it (yes, that one has to be on it if you are a manufacturer!), wrapped in plastic with protective plastic wedges over each corner? If yes, please send me the address of that hardware store; I'll immediately buy a few there.

Please don't get me wrong, I also think that Ultimaker spare parts (and Ultimaker products in general) are not cheap (and that the Ultiboard 2 could become a bit less expensive after almost 3 years of lifetime), but please let us do fair comparisons.

Edited by Guest
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry guys, I think there will be no sensefull outcome of this discussion (and a few other discussions in the forum) any more...

I just will add now my two cents to get my frustration out of my mind, and then will stop thinking about (hopefully)...

Sure, parts can be sources somewhere around the world, hacked together by somebody with 2 cents hourly rate and - of couse far below 12 years old...

Nevertheless, something called "inventive work" has also it´s right and know how is expensive - and those who don´t have it pay for it... that´s the world guys...

So I try to put simple: the guys from Ultimaker had the effort of development, putting hours of their employees into something inventive - and of course, they need to get paied for it...

and then, of course every bit and byte - and spare part - need to have a price tag PLUS some overhead cost which enables them to go forward and pay their bills and develop something new on top...

Honestly - buy cheap stuff somewhere in China or elsewhere - best something your local metal workers, farmers or textile manufactors or - better - the company you work for is producing. At least you will loose your jobs as nobody will buy something "expensive" from you and your company has to close down...

And this is the reason why the prices from UM are ok... because they have the KNOW HOW and the ABILITY and the WILL to engineer their great stuff in The Netherlands (and hopefully pay their guys very good as earn it...)...

So finally, I also think that a UM3 upgrade kit would cost a lot and need a lot of effort to implement it correctly (CE certified, safe, monkeyproof) and that´s the reason why it´s simply not feasible or sensefull - at least from a business point of view...

So, now my mind is free of frustration - thanks for reading and hopefully I ignited the plug at somebody re-thinking his opinion...

Edited by Guest
  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Announcements

  • Our picks

    • Architect Design Contest | Vehicles.
      We're open for entries! - Design and submit your 3D designs of architectural entourage - vehicles - for a chance to win a large filament pack. Presenting an idea, an architectural design or something as big as an urban project isn't easy. A scaled model can really help to get your idea across.
        • Like
      • 24 replies
    • What The DfAM?
      I'm Steve Cox, an experienced engineer familiar with 3D printing. I wanted to share some DfAM guidelines with this community to help and make stronger parts.
      I'm also an Autodesk Certified Instructor for Fusion 360, so many of the images in ...
        • Thanks
        • Like
      • 23 replies
×

Important Information

Welcome to the Ultimaker Community of 3D printing experts. Visit the following links to read more about our Terms of Use or our Privacy Policy. Thank you!